Leave weed alone!
In case you guys didnt know this guy wants to repeal the laws that Obama put in place for weed. He thinks its bad.
@Ginger Incorporated, good. My brother did 3 marijuanas one time and he was never the same. I just dont get how people can inject the weeds into themselves
@Ginger Incorporated, funny how it coincided with California legalizing it
@Captain Anderson, well most people recognize that its not that bad
@Ginger Incorporated, if I remember correctly, it was only the laws on recreational use, not medical.
And it’s really more of just enforcing federal law than anything else. Congress should change the laws if people want medical marijuana.
@Ginger Incorporated, well obviously, Obama supported it so it must be bad
@Ginger Incorporated, not bad in comparison to Cocain, but still not Good per say, anything other then air going into your lungs can't be beneficial. From the research, it just seems to have negative effects on people who are growing. So legal age should be like 24. Same with alcohol. I can tell a stoner from a mile away just from there mannerism, especially when there à teen and they breath that stuff all day long for years.
@jesvi, oh yea for sure. As an edible or pill its better for you. But yes i agree.
@Ginger Incorporated, 1) Obama didn’t make any ‘laws’ about weed, Congress makes federal laws
2) Obama’s justice department had a policy to not enforce federal law which currently lists weed as a controlled substance
3) which means there is a conflict between the federal government and states that have legalized recreational weed
4) the current DoJ rescinded the memo and has a new policy saying each state’s US attorney can independently decide whether or not to enforce federal law in their own state
5) congress needs to decide if they want to remove weed from the list of controlled substances
Cmon guys, do some research please.
@Pubmarine Shamwich, woooaaaah ok. Appreciate the info my man, just take it down. Was just trying to summarize but thank you for specifying.
@Ginger Incorporated, just making sure we’re all informed, that’s all
@Ginger Incorporated, he also had private prison stock. This means that if he can make more laws to put people in prison he gets more money.
He also wants to step up civil asset forfeiture.. because the hell with due process right?
Sessions, just shut the heck up
Only three types of people still call marijuana a gateway drug. Racist, idiots, or people making jokes about it. And yes there is a difference. Its rare but sometimes there are smart racists.
Wait. Make that 4 types. Some people are just a$$holes and want to control other people.
@Seohn, Or maybe they just believe something different than you did you ever think of that? Not everyone who disagrees with you is stupid or a racist.
@Kliment Voroshilov, Well, it’s hard to believe, in this case, when you have lawmakers like Steve Alford talking about how marijuana was originally restricted because African Americans “basically responded the worst to all of those drugs because of their character makeup. Their genetics.”
@Berntley, I didn't say that there weren't people who believe that based on racism, or at least I did not intend to. But to say that the only people who believe that are stupid or racist is wrong and unproductive.
How about instead of just calling them racist you disprove their points.
@Kliment Voroshilov, I get what you mean. However, we have people like this in a position of power who like to spread this kind of information, and it sort of “legitimizes” this low-key racism. So to say that everyone is either racist or stupid might be an overstatement, but the source of the information needs to be taken into account. As for the “gateway drug” idea, that seems to be “war on drugs” propaganda, just like the shît that says marijuana is more addictive than cigarettes, or contains “4x the cancer causing tar of cigarettes”. And that whole campaign is just another issue entirely.
@Berntley, I don't think you can dismiss the gateway drug idea as just propaganda. The data is mixed at best.
It may not be more addictive than cigarettes but the pot advocates that claim it's entirely nonaddictive are equally full of crap, anything that causes dopamine release can be addictive.
I don't have a strong opinion either way because I don't think the information that I have seen supports a conclusion.
@Kliment Voroshilov, I think the idea behind “gateway drug” is misleading. Like you said, the data is mixed, and the assumption that correlation proves causation in this instance is just offensively presumptuous. It’s far more likely that someone who is open to marijuana use has a certain proclivity for using mind altering substances for one reason or another, but this can be taken back to alcohol and cigarettes.
As for addictiveness, I personally think there needs to be a distinction between habitual addiction and actual chemical dependence. In the sense of dopamine, that literally means that anything pleasant can be addictive, and there has to be a distinction between that and heroin, where you could literally die if you quit cold turkey.
@Kliment Voroshilov, PS, I don’t have a super strong opinion on the matter, either. I’ve never touched the stuff, so it doesn’t directly matter to me, but I think it’s something that needs to be approached with an open mind, especially considering the rather spectacular medicinal applications that marijuana possesses.
@Berntley, I don't think I would say "offensively presumptuous" but I basically agree with your point.
That's exactly correct, anything pleasant can be addictive but habitual addiction and chemical dependence coincide in many cases. Best example would be cigarette smoking, breaking the habbit from what I have seen personally can be harder than overcoming the chemical portion.
@Kliment Voroshilov, I agree on breaking the habit. However, and correct me if I’m wrong, but there are really no physical symptoms of withdrawal from marijuana, right? And you don’t build much of a tolerance? I could be wrong on either point.
And I say offensive, because to so blatantly skew the numbers in such a way as to impress such a negative tone like they do with “gateway drug”, is indeed something I would consider to be an offense to the entire campaign.
@Berntley, to your PS.
I am in a similar position as far as use goes and I agree that open mindedness is important but I would say that has to go both ways. The medicinal applications I am not qualified to speak on but it is early days and I think more work needs to be done for conclusive results.
@Kliment Voroshilov, From studies I’ve seen, as well as direct application, the results can be overwhelming. Not always 100% positive, but that’s where allowing research for the purpose of refinement comes in. I work in mental health, and I’ve seen marijuana work pretty well for pain, anxiety, depression. And if there was more we could do with the drug, publicly, I’m sure we could make all those applications go much further. That being said, I also see a lot of people in the mental health community pulling for legalization (recreational OR medicinal), who would definitely not benefit as much as they’d like to think hey would.
@Kliment Voroshilov, For example, paranoid schizophrenics probably don’t need to smoke weed.
@Berntley, Well it sounds like you are more educated and qualified on this topic that I am. Although the paranoid schizophrenic seems obvious.
If you ever need help sizing a distillation column or determining the heat duty of a heat exchanger I'm your man.
@Kliment Voroshilov, haha, I’ll keep that in mind. Good talk, man.
@Berntley, I agree good talk. Have a great day/morning/evening depending on your time zone.
@Kliment Voroshilov, same/same/same
@Kliment Voroshilov, you are right I did forget one category of person. The people who fall for propaganda. You should probably look up the history of marijuana. Compared to other drugs that are legal. The only reason it became illegal in the first place is because of racism. So there are very many reasons why it’s still illegal other than the ones I’ve described.
Also have you ever met anybody who used marijuana before cigarettes and alcohol. If you want to bring in the subject of gateway drugs you start at the source. And the vast majority of people start there. So the real gateway drugs are the ones that are legal. Which is why I say the people who use the gateway drug excuse to keep it illegal are stupid. Because they don’t think about this.
As a joking side note. This is why the AI overlords should take over. Laws should be based on logic and reason not opinion and propaganda.
So much for State's rights.
@Jim Carrey Acolyte, What? All that they did was remove the memo saying that the prosecutors were not allowed to prosecute for pot. The federal prosecutor for each state still has prosecutorial discretion. Meaning that they can chose to still not prosecute.
@Kliment Voroshilov, why would they remove that? It doesn't make sense. The states already said it was legal, meaning no one is going to get prosecuted, ever, under any circumstance.
@Jim Carrey Acolyte, It makes oerfect sense. Marijuana is still listed as a controlled substance federally. The way that Obama did this circumvented the rules for the American government, he essentially was chowing to ignore the law because it didn't agree with his political beliefs. If he wanted to do it properly he needed to push for Congress to remove it from that list.
It's unlikely however that the attorneys for the state's that legalized it would undertake federal prosecution meaning that this likely changes nothing.
@Kliment Voroshilov, it opens the door for the federal government to arbitrarily overstep the state's right to let its people do as it says. The federal government could one day decide to prosecute whoever it sees fit. Don't act like this is ok. Sessions is against recreational marijuana. He doesn't want it. He's looking to regress the rights the states have given people. And it would've never gotten through congress so Obama decided to let the states decide, since there is nothing in the constitution about marijuana that should be all there is to it, it's a state issue, nothing more.
@Jim Carrey Acolyte, No it most certainly does not open that door. If anything it was reversing the arbitrary application of federal law.
@Kliment Voroshilov, yea I'll accept anything that restricts how the federal government can prosecute citizens, thanks.
@Jim Carrey Acolyte, So there is no problem with arbitrarily ignoring the law in your mind?
This is the hilarious thing. I support giving the decision back to the state's but your getting all bent out of shape at me simply because I insist that the government follow the letter of the law. If the law can be arbitrarily defined we may as well install a monarch right now.
@Kliment Voroshilov, bent out of shape? We're just having a discussion. And no, there are problems with arbitrarily ignoring the law, but that hasn't happened here. President wrote something in as all president have before and still do and people ran with it and liked it. No reason to say anything about it now, just let it ride. Maybe if it was someone else I'd be worried about it going through the proper channels but this is sessions we're talking about. The guy that said "good people don't smoke marijuana". He's not interested in redacting this to send it through the proper channels. He's interested in redacting it, period.
@Jim Carrey Acolyte, Its almost like this wouldnt have been a problem had they done it properly in the first place? And I don't think you can say that sessions did this because he doesn't like marijuana, because you don't actually know his motivations.
@Kliment Voroshilov, it would've never been done at all had it gone through the proper channels. Obama did it on his way out with a split congress. The vote never would have passed and its a crisis that needed to be resolved right then. The rate at which we have people being incarcerated over a plant is disgusting. Also don't be wilfully ignorant. If you've heard sessions talk about marijuana you can draw conclusions regarding his motive. He compares it to heroin.
@Jim Carrey Acolyte, How was it a crisis that needed to be resolved?
And I am not being willfully ignorant you are attributing motive.
@Kliment Voroshilov, as I said, people's lives are being ruined over a plant at an astonishing rate. Our incarceration rate is a national crisis. And if you're willing to tie the conversation up because you think it's impossible to tell a motive from observed behaviour then we have nothing more to discuss here. It seems you're only interested in defending some old tool's decision that will doubtless hinder the fight against prohibition.
@Jim Carrey Acolyte, Ok, few things things.
1. To say that it's just a plant or it's natural is pointless.
2. Our incarceration rate is not a crisis. If you don't want to be incarcerated don't break the law.
3. I am saying that sessions motive is immaterial and unimportant.
4. I am not defending some old tools decision, Well i am but that's not the point, I am defending the proper application of the law.
@Kliment Voroshilov, oh thank god.. for a minute there I thought you were a rational human being and that my argument may have been too weak. Thank you for confirming you're not. Makes me look way better. "if you don't want to go to jail don't break the law". What's my incentive when the law is unlawful? Consider this quote from Robert A. Heinlein, and then maybe get your nose out of big governments asshole. "I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I am morally responsible for everything I do." You're only on this side of the argument because something you don't enjoy isn't needlessly outlawed. Hint, alcohol has been illegal. Religious freedom has been illegal. Women voting has been illegal. And all of them were held up by people like you. You're on the wrong side of history.
@Jim Carrey Acolyte, I won't insult you, you aren't irrational you're simply wrong, and I wish you would have offered me the same courtesy.
We certainly would want that would we