It’s weird how people forget that Gandalf is essentially a minor god.
@Ewok612, not even essentially, he IS a minor god
@Professor Kukui, god/angel/spirit/whatever. It doesn’t map well
@Ewok612, he and the other wizards in middle earth are servants of their god, put there to guide the inhabitants of the realm. Gandalf has a lesser amount of power than Saruman, thus being gray. But when Saruman turned against god and man, Gandalf was made into the new white wizard.
@Ewok612, not to mention Gimli, who is basically miner god
@Scuzzinator, get out
@Scuzzinator, but know I love you
@Ewok612, too late. I’m already dug in.
@Ewok612, ehhh, more like high level angel
@RepostSniper, that’s what I mean, it doesn’t map cleanly to a Judeo-Christian system. He’s bottom tier, but he’s still a celestial being. He’s a Maia so he’s a god but he’s measly compared to the Valar and takes orders from Eru.
@Ewok612, it does map to a Judeo-Christian system, almost to exactly. Tolkien’s entire fiction is a deliberate allegory of Christianity. Eru Iluvatar is God (“the One”), the Maia and Valar are two of several tiers of angel, and Gortaur (Sauron), an Ainur (another class of angel) is Satan, as they both are cast out and become evil. It’s not a pantheon; there’s only one god, and the wizards, Melkor, Sauron, the balrogs, etc. are all angels with varying allegiances and levels of power.
@RepostSniper, there are ties and intentions, but it wasn’t clean at any point. Still allegory, but it straw mans out. Otherwise it would just be the holy bible.
@Professor Kukui, yes Gandalf is immortal. To wears a human body isn't his natural state. He is one of the Maiar, something as angels or minor deities as Sauron is, too. Gandalf and his buddies just wear the guise of wizards aka the istari, but he is one of the strongest.
@RepostSniper, “I cordially dislike allegory in all its manifestations, and always have done so since I grew old and wary enough to detect its presence. I much prefer history – true or feigned– with its varied applicability to the thought and experience of readers. I think that many confuse applicability with allegory, but the one resides in the freedom of the reader, and the other in the purposed domination of the author.” Direct quote from Tolkien
@Ewok612, again, Tolkien very deliberately modeled the LotR divinity after Christianity, mainly Genesis. He was a very religious man, and he wrote his fiction to mirror his beliefs as he returned to faith after the war. The parallels aren’t accidental or coincidental. He literally just reskinned the Christian monotheism into a fantasy world because that’s what he was familiar with
@RepostSniper, you seem hellbent on both making a point and contradicting me, but your point truly doesn’t contradict mine and your contradictions truly don’t have a point.
@Ewok612, lol, fair enough. I’ve researched Tolkien and his works a lot (it was a project for school), so I just felt like sharing what I learned. To your original point: I agree, and the films do a particularly bad job of showing Gandalf for the super powerful being that he actually is. Then again, all of the other wizards either failed their task or straight up betrayed it. So maybe Gandalf used 99% of his power fighting the temptation to follow suit? Lame...
@RepostSniper, well, the books also don’t show you his full power because that is a requirement for the Istari. They are the same sort of being as Sauron but their directive requires that they rouse the free peoples rather than use brute force. The only time Gandalf broke that was to slay the Balrog.
But yeah, the rest didn’t do so well. Saruman violated that directive then fell to temptation(or vice-versa), Radagast got caught up in minutiae, and the blue bois (apparently) played support.
@Professor Kukui, Uh yeah, Gandalf's a minor god, but kind of a lame one, dude cant even take on a Balrog without dying, the lords of the Noldor of old could take one in single combat any day
@RepostSniper, Considering how Tolkien himself admits that Gandalf was inspired by Odin, you know a Norse God, i find your claims dubious at best and intentionally misleading at worst. Add that the direct quote that Golden God kindly provided and it seems like you are talking straight out of your ass my dude. Not everything has to be about Christianity. If i remember correctly Tolkien started writing his books during the war as a way to keep his mind off the horrors. Had nothing to do with Christianity. Especially again when you realize that he went out of his way to take inspiration from a myriad of beliefs and cultures. Elfs and Dwarfs are from Nordic Beliefs after all. You wont find mention of a single Elf or Dwarf in the Christian mythology. So pls try and not spread misinformation, that would be great.
I’m pretty sure Gimli could get the ring to mount doom, he’d just get there covered in blood and from the wrong direction
I'm sure Gandalf is at least like... 3%. This meme is inaccurate
@Duncan5769, lore wise he is the 99%
Spoiler : Sean Bean dies.
A Took always knows how to bring the party down...