Guys.....people who don't social distance aren't hurting themselves they're hurting the vulnerable! This meme does not apply whatsoever. The "social darwinism" at play here is really just harming those who don't have a natural tolerance to this disease. The "unfit" in this case aren't the people who are or are not social distancing but the people who could die from the virus.
Okay, now let me just climb down from my soapbox here
@robee, well, maybe if they wind up getting a little sick, they'll learn. Or if they continually go out, and their family member doesn't, and their family member gets sick, hopefully they'll learn. Or like that pastor who held service anyway, even practicing the 6 ft rule (granted it's still in an enclosed church for an hour) and he died and his whole family got sick. Maybe if more people have that happen to people they know, they'll start to listen.
If the people that raised those who aren't physically distancing die, it should still have a similar effect as Darwinism.
@mas2de, the issue is that on average each infected person infects around 3 other people, and that will end up getting to the vulnerable. The people who aren't social distancing are more likely to be yonger and will probably fair pretty well. So many people are going to get this weather they social distance or not, but when you don't you're killing people plain and simple.
@robee, in most cases it’s harming other people. But there is one case and you can find the news article where a guy was calling it a political hoax and a few weeks later he ends up dying from it.
The only irony from this is all the people claiming the govt has the right to infringe on constitutional rights and proceed to not even bat an eye at the fact that the places where protest are happening there is in fact massive overreach. Take NJ where a tulip farm that offered drive thru tours, AS IN NO ONE PHYSICAL LEAVES THIER CAR, was told to close because having it open violated the social distancing orders. Then there is NY where churches were told to close even for Easter but mosques are allowed to continue holding daily prayers despite that meaning people being closer than 6ft. By this point it wouldn’t surprise me if I saw a comment bragging about ratting out a small get together to the police.
@ThatGuyx79, yet all those people freely give up greater civil liberties to cellphone companies and Facebook without batting an eye
The protesters in my town are all social distancing. They are requesting to start opening the economy with social distancing. That way they can make money and protect themselvee
Crackermyer just acknowledged both sides of the argument...why are y'all commenting like he just praised the protesters and their cause.
@Canada Gooses, "they have a right to do it" and "they are right to do it" are two different things and most of y'all read the latter
@Canada Gooses, I'd never thought that I'd ever agree with some Canada gooses, and yet here I am agreeing with them. 2020, what a time to be alive
@Yung Saltine Cracker, <3
When does the cure become worse than the disease?
@CocoasBro, VACCINES BRO VACCINES.
I agree people should social distance. However, I also agree people have a constitutional right to protest and assemble against their government.
@Crackermyer, The thing is, diseases don't care about your rights
@Crackermyer, just because you have a constitutional right to do something doesn’t mean exercising that right isn’t stupid. For example, I have the constitutional right to tell my boss to go fvck himself. Exercising that right would be a pretty darn stupid thing to do, but I have the right to do it.
@Crackermyer, you also have the right to drink, but when your actions endanger others like if you were drinking and driving, those rights can be suspended
If you are spreading a disease then you are endangering others
@The Inactive Account, agreed to an extent. But that’s like making bonfires illegal because the neighbor down the road smells the smoke and believes it’s harmful. It’s the same reason radicals believe guns should be banned because feelings. It’s hard to draw a line on what is dangerous and harmful to others (like drinking and driving) and what is infringement (banning guns) there’s an opportunity cost that really has to be looked at and we can’t tell for sure what the cost will be. I agree massing up is a bad idea, but I don’t think force closing businesses and freedom of even local travel or public places makes sense. If I go to the beach, and see too many people there for comfort, I’ll leave. It should always be up to the individual, not government. This isn’t a commonly agreed upon topic just because we know so little.
@The Inactive Account, I get the example with the drinking. Driving is a privilege and not a right. Same analogy with drinking works with public intoxication though
@The Inactive Account, drinking alcohol is not a right. It is a privilege. That’s why it can be suspended same with driving. Your car is not guaranteed by the constitution
@fallingback09, that was nicely put sir
@Scuzzinator, But you have the right to do it and NO ONE can rake it from you. It’s YOUR choice. Not the government’s
@fallingback09, we don't know so little. We have history to guide us. The great influenza pandemic of 1918-1920 provided ample evidence of how social distancing helped, and abandonment of social distancing caused worsening. And banning guns is not what gun activists want. It's what 2nd amendment fanatics say will happen, because they believe any restriction is unreasonable. The right to bear arms does have reasonable restrictions (you can't have machine guns, or antitank missiles or tanks, for example). The question is where the line on guns should be drawn. Because everything is a balance between individual rights and societal responsibilities.
@fallingback09, I’d say that it’s like allowing owning guns, but banning firing them off in a residential street. The individual might think it’s fine, but the guy who gets a few bullets through his window would disagree.
There are times when people have to be told “in this specific set of circumstances, that particular thing is too stupid”.
@occasionalmutant, we don’t know enough. Testing a rare, the sample is ridiculously small, and we have no clue how many people have had it and not even known it. Again, I believe in social distancing, and of course it’s common sense, but I believe in individualism. I think it depends on where you live with the guns situation but being from Michigan, year it is about banning guns. Freedom doesn’t mean someone is dumb or smart, it’s what they choose to do with the freedom. I think smoking weed is dumb, but it’s a freedom (in some states). The line is exactly my point. The restriction is a line drawn but we can’t prove it’s going to help in the long run or hurt because this is unique. What’s worse: getting the corona virus or losing your job? The problem is we let government answer for the majority instead of leaving it to the individual. Now if business owners choose to close down and lay off workers and shut down, fine as long as the government limits span of control.
@Nellybert , agreed. That’s a common sense law since it can actually cause harm to someone else. But then it starts to fade in other ways, making it oxymoronic. Me driving could risk hitting a pedestrian (I’m not a bad driver, this is just an example). Does that mean I shouldn’t drive, or should we make it illegal to drive? It’s about risk and learning about it. But it should be on the individual, not the government playing Chess with us.
@occasionalmutant, there are also places getting really stupid about arresting people for being out on their own property. I know it’s a small number, but we as Americans can’t let that grow.
@Scuzzinator, true but that doesnt mean they dont have a constitutional right to do it.
@The Inactive Account, drinking isnt a right.
@18bluecat, and rights dont care about the disease.
@fallingback09, As long as you do it with due care and attention, then it’s fine - it’s only if you do the stupid (driving drunk, high, with your feet, etc) that there’s an issue.
So protesting, fine - as long as you do it sensibly (social distancing or whatever). Just don’t be stupid.
@Scuzzinator, it may be stupid but it doesn't make it not a right, the people should have the right to be stupid and exercise their rights cause otherwise they're locked in their homes by the government until they starve. The reason people are protesting is cause they're running out of money for basic needs like food, saying that they shouldn't exercise their right to protest is sociopathic, put yourself in their shoes and understand their desperation before you disparage people for wanting to live...
@ Seductive Cheeto, isn't that why the gov't issued a $1200 check to anyone making less that $75k/yr and less than $1200 up to an AGI of $99k/yr. Yes people should have savings and now is the time to be frugal and only use the savings when needed. I get that not everyone does have savings though. I still think the gov't should've suspended all rent and mortgage payments because $400 can feed your whole family for a month if you're careful. $1200 *might pay your rent/mortgage for a month. $1200 with no rent means you've got a couple months of food. And that's a MUCH smaller stimulus debt that the gov't goes into. Now we have over $2T just for this stimulus package and they're looking at another trillion soon. Most of that money goes to corps, not people who need good. It's a giant corrupt shjtshow. It's good that people get some stimulus money, especially for those out of a job, I just think it was done the worst way possible for the immediate future and the long run.
@Crackermyer, you're an absolute idiot. And this pic applies 100% to you.
@Nellybert , exactly my point. If they are following guidelines, protest isn’t necessarily a exponential risk.
@mas2de, the stimulus package came a month and half into the quarantine, most people will have used that money to pay the bills they missed out on like I did.
Even if the stimulus package did just make sure everyone stayed fed, it isn't a reason to throw away our civil rights.
@Crackermyer, hey guys. Wow. Didn’t expect so many replies so let me clarify my point. First off, yes, it would be stupid not to social distance. Every medical expert is recommending it, so people should abide by it. It’s just common sense. However, I also believe that my constitutional rights for life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness shouldn’t be violated like the government seems to be doing right now. If I was dumb enough to go hug and make out with a bunch of people, I SHOULD be able to do so. It’s MY choice. Not the government’s. Of course, I’m not going to do that. But it’s still my constitutional right if I choose to exercise it. Moreover, this virus has an extremely low mortality rate. The US claims we have about 800,000 cases, and nobody has an idea where they are coming from because we don’t have enough test kits. The government has told hospitals to mark down anyone who has died from ANY respiratory-related illness as a COVID death. Even if it wasn’t COVID.
@Crackermyer, so the death rate is more likely lower than the originally-guessed 4%. And the way basic microbiology works is this... the more people get it, the faster we would build immunity to it. And I’m not saying we should put the elderly and immunocompromised at risk. They should quarantine themselves to stay safe until we find a cure. My main problem is closing down the economy. The unemployment rate has gone up by 3%. Over 17,000,000 people are jobless. For every 1% unemployment goes up, 40,000 people die. So why are we shutting down the economy for so long? It doesn’t make sense. We need to open the economy back up and put people back to work. Feel free to source-check everything I just said.
@Crackermyer, it sounds like you're in favour of the "herd immunity" method. That's insanity. You'd rather put millions of people at risk, than try to prevent the spread of a virus that is killing thousands of people daily? I mean, sh!t, we've got the world's leading doctors all telling us that the way to get a hold on this thing and try to figure out how to eradicate it, is to try to prevent the spread of it. But hey, some dude on funny pics said we'd be better off all catching it like it's chicken pox to a four-year-old, so let's just all go back to work.
@EndToOutside, lol you sound so salty
@Jackalarf, solid input. Give yourself a cookie.
@fallingback09, True. I think they’re idiots (especially the guy who said “reopen my State or I’ll do it myself” - what’s he going to do? March people to work at gunpoint? Round people up and force them to go shopping and socialise?) but as long as they’re being sensible it’s fine to protest.
It’s the asshats who’re crowding together and risking further spread of the disease that I have an issue with. I saw photos the other day of a protest in Tel Aviv where they were all standing 6 feet apart, so it is possible to protest and be sensible.
@EndToOutside, Also, herd immunity may not be possible here - it looks like a lot of people who catch it and recover aren’t producing antibodies, so won’t be immune and can catch/spread it again. It also means that antibody tests aren’t very good for tracking spread as it won’t show that they had it.
It’s as if people under 40 just get better without their immune systems ever fully winding up to fight the virus.
@Nellybert , yea that guys was a bit extreme. But for example the people who were driving their cars and stayed in them were playing smart. If you’re gonna make a statement, do it the right way.
@EndToOutside, the point of reducing the spread was to flatten the curve, not eradicate the virus. This virus is never going away. And even if we get a vaccine, which there is no guarantee, it is likely a year away. At some point the economy is going to have to reopen, because that is also a very real threat. Over 22 million people are now unemployed in the United States, and that's not the end of it. If we aren't careful this virus could be the least of our problems. The good news is that we've seemed to have flattened the curve successfully so that our healthcare system won't be overrun. We are going to have to figure out soon exactly how we open the economy and practice common sense social distancing
@fallingback09, Smart or lazy, could be either one. :)
No one in my circle of friends has changed their habits other than the stores being closed. We go hang out at each other’s houses, we go to work, we don’t wash our hands anymore than we normally would. We see our families in other cities. None of us or anyone we know is sick. It is so ridiculous that the world is going insane over such a measly virus. Remember swine flu? H1N1? Ebola? Millions of people worldwide hospitalized, and no one batted an eye. Wake up people. You are being indoctrinated into a life of fear in order to give up your rights and freedom to the government.
@Bobaganusche88, you my friend have blood on your hands
@Bad Canadian, I’m ok with that. I don’t visit anyone that’s at risk. If me and my friends get sick we get sick. Based on current estimates by Stanford and usc if you got 10,000 of us together and gave us all covid there’s a 10% chance one of us would die. Not that 10% would die but a 10% chance a single person would die. We can live with that risk
@BigJohnson86, that estimate is bull, it applies if you can have 10,000 healthy young people, which is unrealistic in a community. If 25 % are vunerable(old age, obesity or lung issues) they have a much higher risk of death. Even if your friends aren't at risk, they can spread it to people who are, because it's that contagious, like the flu. But the flu we're familiar with doesn't kill 40,000+ americans in a few months. I always thought americans were patriotic, guess that isn't true for all
@Bad Canadian, no that estimate is exactly who we get together with. So the number is exactly right. If you wanna spend time with at risk people have at it. If you think freedom not safety isn’t the most celebrated tradition of American patriots you do not know americans at all. You’re wrong that 40,000 don’t die for flu season it’s been as high as 80,000 for the USA. You should do some research. Also while those 45,000 deaths are from covid 19 the flu death rate has gone to almost 0.
@BigJohnson86, even if the flu death is at 80,000, that's without quarantine, imagine the Covid death toll without it, it was estimated to reach almost a million in america. Patriotism is the act of self sacrifice for the betterment of your country and the people that reside within it. Your army is building emergency hospitals, your commander in chief asked states to lockdown. Soldiers give away their liberty to fight for the safety of others. By ignoring the war against Covid, you're no different from a draft dodger, you don't want to sacrifice anything for the safety of your own people.
@Bad Canadian, actually patriotism is about supporting your country and it’s ideals. Google it. And we do quarantine all the at risk flu people who don’t get the shot. So imagine the death toll if we didn’t all but force the shot down the throat of everyone in the at risk categories. Also don’t lecture me on what soldiers do. I served 9 years and not once did we ever discuss giving our freedoms away just because people are scared. We actually believe that when fear is high that’s when we should stand tall. I’ll bet to a man every soldier would rather die on their feet than live on their knees. Most of us going around see people living in fear with no end in sight and we’d rather risk our lives than live that way. If you’re at risk you should absolutely quarantine yourself. If not we should be returning to normal life. You can keep trying to reframe the argument but the fact is nothing your saying is fact. It’s all opinion and that opinion is based on fear.
@BigJohnson86, tell that to all the dead doctors and nurses. As a soldier, who else are you fighting for but for your people? You suffer so they don't have to. Don't see how that isn't patrotic. Also patriotism :"Patriotism or national pride is the feeling of love, devotion and sense of attachment to a homeland and alliance with other citizens who share the same sentiment." Googled it. Seems you invented the ideals part, which makes zero sense, as not everyone in your country, even in the army, shares the same ideals. I haven't been to the States in awhile, but I don't think y'all are communist enough to all think the same way. And you're right, we should stand tall and fight Covid. For example isolation, because people can be asymptomatic, and no matter how quarantined people who are at risk are, they will inevitably contact others. By going out, you're actively spreading the virus, you're putting strain on the healthcare workers on the frontline.
@Bad Canadian, and it's not "peoole are scared", peoppe are in DANGER. Corvid is DANGEROUS. It's killing people, fast and in large numbers. It's a GLOBAL PANDEMIC. No government would shutdown their economy for a small virus, YET EVERY COUNTRY HAS. It seems you're a bit behind, except your ignorance is endangering the lives of others. Once this is over, life returns to normal, and hopefully everything reopens. But because of "tough" guys like you, it's gonna last longer and more people will die
@BigJohnson86, well you just sound ignorant Lmao
@Jackalarf, I’m not sure you know what ignorant means if you think the one in this argument who’s actually cited the studies done on the subject is ignorant.
@Bad Canadian, so what do you think share the same sentiment means? We don’t think the same way. But we should all hold to a core set of ideals. I also don’t think you know what danger means. If you want to deny the only science we have on the covid infection rates then fine but I’m in the same amount of danger from covid as I am driving my car. I don’t let fear of that change my behavior. I take basic safety measures and continue my life. It is 100% possible for everyone at risk to quarantine themselves, but no one is willing to discuss that because of not wanting to look like a bigot. Also I’m perfectly fine with other countries shutting down their economies. I do not care what they do. I do care that a country that calls itself the land of the free will handout all sorts of government controls out of fear. I don’t claim to be tough. I claim to be willing to accept risk. If you’re not willing to accept risk then you live like that and I’ll live my way.
@Bad Canadian, also under what conditions would you reopen and at what clip? I can never get a good answer from people who say we shouldn’t be reopening
@BigJohnson86, reopen when the curve is flattened, listen to the science and you might've known that already. And your way of life is endangering the lives of many others, it's not like driving, more like driving drunk. You'll probably be fine, but that old couple you just ran over won't be. Anyways you can spew all the garbage you want, you've already proven that you don't care about your people. You keep hiding behind government control, Jesus they don't control anything. They're scrambling to save as many lives as possible. You're the guy that stopping fireman from hosing down a burning house because they work for the government. Your commander in chief declared state of emergency, all states are in states of emergency, a first in american history. Live your little lie if you want, but as I said, very unpatriotic, especially since most americans are choosing to stay inside.
I like snacks
Good point, take government out of it and let social Darwinism run its course.
@XiozTaschez, I’m drunk, what’s wrong with you?