Yea you have to pay out of your pocket for college here but how do you think that the government is paying for the "free" or cheaper college everywhere else. Taxes my friends
@Reginald, personally I see plenty of people in my university getting their college for free or nearly so. I of course can't. But there are some who do.
@Reginald, well I mean we already pay like half of our pay check anyway but we get zero benefits from it or at least the middle class doesn't get anything
@Reginald, and we're talking like 60% income taxes
@Reginald, "We're all thinking it, I might as well say it...'Socialists'."
@Reginald, Maybe is congress knew how to spend it's money properly
@Reginald, 100% correct. Tax wedge for Germany is 49.3% while ours is 31%.... People just keep repeating what they read without looking into actual facts.
Those countries have mandatory miltary time. Military = college. Guess what! I joined the Marines, served five years, and now I get free college and a monthly stipened! I literally pulled myself up by bootstraps...
@Trevthemighty, I personally like the idea of mandatory military time for all citizens, it would open up many people's eyes to the world around them plus give them different opportunities for the future.
@drawAline2UandMe, I don't think it should necessarily be mandatory military time, our military is massive enough as it is, but there should be a mandatory menial job requirement, that military members would obviously be exempt from they serve more than the rest of us, but whether it's flipping burgers, bussing/waiting tables, construction work etc. Our society needs to learn to value hard work as well as intellect to create a healthy balance.
@Captain Charles Vane, I already have a good job why would I want a menial job?
@DougFunnyQuailMan, I don't mean it in a way that everyone has to quit their jobs now, we were talking about requiring everyone to serve in the military, the way that system would be set up is that after high school everyone would be required to enlist for a few years, the system I was proposing would work the same way, but instead of serving in the military, which let's be honest a lot of people aren't cut out for, everyone would just learn to value a good days hard work, there's a difference between physical labor and tasks of the mind, our education system stresses that everyone be well rounded, it's important that everyone be able to see issues from all sides and adding that to everyone's shared life experience would more likely than not have an overall positive effect on our society as a whole both in the way that we approach things and economically too
That's the price of freedom and lower taxes 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
@Tiny Tina, dumb Americas is the price.
@Tiny Tina, funny, your country had more poverty than these nations. So how them low taxes working out for you? Oh and these guys also have free full public health care...
@Tiny Tina, yes be proud of your poor standard of living, high cost of living and growing poverty gap... much to be proud of.
@TheMonkeyGod, I am from the united states, and I agree whole-heartedly with you.
@TheMonkeyGod, Define free. And explain to me why people from other countries come here for our ever expensive healthcare?
If you can't afford it, there is charity out there. There is help if you need it. And no one will refuse you, nor can by law.
@peow42, free, as in you don't pay. Yes there is taxes, but these countries get most of those from companies.
@TheMonkeyGod, and so the American companies will just go some place with less taxation eventually. And in the long term it screws us over even more. We can't be like Europe because we are too different from them. Besides the American government running healthcare is just a bad idea. Have you been to a VA before? A post office? Anything like that? Of our health system is run the same way. Which it will be, will be a nightmare
@peow42, you're not that different from Europe. Where do you think all the white Americans came from? And not that long ago either. In reality you've all been convinced you can't and sold the American dream, which in reality in unattainable for the majority. But that's cool. Keep going the way you are... why change? Why bother trying to make things better?
Sanders is planning on making state schools free or nearly free if he's elected. Just an FYI for all you college kids.
@Stalker Ent, I'm a college kid but my next year is my fourth so I think it's coming a little late for me.
@BearDaniels, I'm in that same boat. But I know with how the world's going free (or at least more reasonably priced) tuition would be amazing for my children to be able to experience some day. I have worked my ass off over the last 4 years in order to avoid taking out any loans. I am in my fourth year and debt free (including a semester abroad), so it's possible to do, but it gets harder and harder every generation. I want my children to be able to enjoy college and focus on their schoolwork instead of working 30 hours a week like I have.
@TheKnightsWhoSayNi, where do you work and go to school that working 30 hours a week covers tuition and all living expenses?? People that work full time jobs cqn have a hard time covering living expenses let alone college tuition
@TheKnightsWhoSayNi, what is your job and how do I apply
@Laser Kitty, I live at home so I don't have much in the way of living expenses and I work two jobs during the summer and one during the school year. I also have a few scholarships and grants that have helped a ton over the years. The FAFSA gave me a couple good grants the last two years. There're plenty of opportunities for scholarship money, but honestly just working and saving money has helped me so much. It just means you can't go online shopping all the time or eat out every day.
@Devils Avocado, I only make about $9.50 an hour at my regular job, but my summer job pays over $12.50 per hour. Saving money has helped me out a lot. And honestly, books and tuition are my biggest expenses since I live at home. Other than that it's just the expenses of my car and anything fun I want to do like concerts or movies with my girlfriend or whatever.
@Stalker Ent, Good ol Sanders. The only respectable liberal running right now (In my opinion so please don't kill me)
@TheKnightsWhoSayNi, instead of experiencing tuition, why not just a mortgage?
@Stalker Ent, and how is he gonna pay for that?
@thehomage, IIRC by cutting military, raising taxes on the top 10% of the 1%, closing tax loopholes for companies, raising import tax (to make it more profitable for companies to make things here instead of China), aswell as some things I'm sure I missed
@Glorious Grapefruit, he's a socialist, not a liberal. He's a radical, but you do you, man
@Stalker Ent, The only reason state schools could be free is if the state started paying for every school expense again. The reason it isn't free now is because states have so much other stuff to pay for
@thehomage, socialist is about as liberal as you can get, on the conservative end it would be Marxist style communism
@Stalker Ent, Ill have graduated before he can make any changes but it's still a good idea! And maybe it'll help out with postgrad work
@Stalker Ent, that would be a great idea, if Sanders wasn't a socialist. Socialism works great until you've run out of everyone else's money.
@Fun Facts 101, Idk about that, there are plenty of socialist countries that are much better off than the US in terms of welfare programs, unemployment rates, and education.
@Fun Facts 101, that's not how it works, economies are (for the most part) closed systems. The government spends money, that money goes to private citizens, private citizens save a percentage of that money (percentage saved changes with your income level) and spend the rest of it, part of that goes to another private citizen who then repeats that process and part of it goes to the government in taxes. The part where you are mistaken is the bit where the percentage saved changes generally according to income level, poor people spend virtually all of their money putting it back in to the economy. Is the money the government gives them currently being spent wisely? No but the solution to that isn't to get rid of it it's to put a better system in place to actually help people.
@TheKnightsWhoSayNi, I love when people say "I live at home" when referring to their parents house. What do they say when the finally get their own place? Lol
@notMrWonka, home is where the free food and laundry is.
Yeah... But taxes are monumentally higher elsewhere. Don't be a moron.
@Kalam1ty, I wouldn't mind higher taxes if it meant having a more educated population and not having to start saving for my future kids' college while I'm in college myself.
@HolyCatchphrase, let's be honest, even if we offered free college, our education level wouldn't change in the US. Those who are educated will stay educated, those who aren't will refuse.
@Kalam1ty, false. The u.s has one of the highest taxes out of all the country's on the planet, we just blow it all on out military, that if we cut 85% of its funding to would still be the most funded military in the world.
@thehomage, I don't think that's true at all. There are plenty of people who would go to college if they could afford it. And if you're right, at least then those educated people could get out of college without debt and start stable lives.
@Ser Waffle Knight, Blowing it on military seems pretty rational considering the fact that it protects all of our freedoms by fighting in wars on the other side of the worl, the side that most infringes on our freedoms. In other words, we need something to power many cars with.
@Benjo786, other side of the worl...like Didney Worl! Yay!
@Benjo786, lol, it's all just about oil. Powering our cars as you said, when if we devoted some research and time, scientists would be able to make more effecient electric vehicles. Things like that, all over the place with the unnecessary trillions in the military.
@Kalam1ty, danish tax is going down 1% every year or so
@Ser Waffle Knight, No, no we don't. Denmark has the highest tax rates in the world, followed by just about every other Scandinavian county.
@Kalam1ty, colleges are just to expensive. In Washington state the republicans actually did something about that, state tuition went down 3 thousand dollars this year. That's actually down, not like it was going to go up 5,000 and instead went up by 2,000. It is 3,000 cheaper per semester this year.
Passed by every republican legislator, and only 2 democratics. Not surprisingly it's very popular with college students. But, state unions hate it and the democrats are trying to reverse it for next year.
@Ser Waffle Knight, I mean, there's a reason why thousands of people from places that have free universities decide to study in the U.S. Simple fact is, it's a higher quality.
@CriTiKa1, I said one of. Not THE. I know that it's higher other places, but there are no good reasons it's as high as it is, lol. I get were you're coming from though.
@HolyCatchphrase, to hell with that. I would much rather pay less taxes and have half the population uneducated and working minimum wage jobs and complaining about how they don't make enough.
@George Feeny, I worked hard I put myself through school applied to a myriad of companies and found a good position in a strong company. Why should I pay more so people can spend their day drinking and getting high.
@Benjo786, rofl, we arent defending sht out there. No disrespect to the soliders but theyre only out there for $$$, our government can give two shts about freedom if there is no profit to be made. If we really cared, north korea wouldnt exsist today
@Ser Waffle Knight, but the money spent on the military pays my bills :( Whatever, still voting Sanders
@I Dexios Divine I, Someone didn't read my comment fully haha.
@Ser Waffle Knight, what?
@I Dexios Divine I, I'm a national guard soldier, we help the people overseas. It doesn't help Americans close by but it helps others. Anyway, being a national guardsman we pulled people out of the snow and brought them to shelter during blizzards, leveed the river when it flooded to protect the town, cleaned up after tornadoes. Guess how much we got paid? $20/day
@peow42, no, did not mean the soldiers are out there for profit, the gov. Is only interested in anything if theres money or control to be made. Couldve worded it differently *shrug*
But wouldn't the government have control over what is taught, like state high schools?
@PleaseBelieveMe, Anything that receives state/federal funding has to follow state/federal rules. A college would be welcome to do whatever it likes, but its funding would be cut. However, most of the rules are pretty universally accepted things, like anti-discrimination laws, and many colleges are already receiving state funding and thus follow state rules.
As far as curriculum, I doubt the government would come up with higher ed standards. And even so, those are minimum standards, aka, students must know this, this, and this. It doesn't mean that schools cannot teach additional material as well. Most colleges already have minimum standards, aka general education requirements.
@Ruupasya, I'll give PBM the worry about being controlled like high schools, most of our society is still structured for the industrial age, high schools undoubtedly included, some state colleges have done a better job than others in breaking free of that mold but the fear that our government would try to keep that mold enforced in colleges is understandable, we don't have a great track record on legislating education.
@Captain Charles Vane, valid points, but since many colleges already follow government protocols, I doubt much would change. I don't think anyone would be interested in instituting a government-mandated college curriculum. The government has better things to worry about.
@Ruupasya, The government spends more time worrying about the things it shouldn't than the things it should is my only concern.
@Ruupasya, the government made federal curriculum for everything below college. It's called common core, and it's terrible.
@talmet, the common core is not terrible (i am studying to be a teacher), nor is it mandatory. some states, like mine (SC) have rejected it and are using their own. Hilariously, it's the exact same thing with different wording.
@Captain Charles Vane, I get that, but in this case it's kind of an all-or-nothing issue. The government already provides funding to colleges and in turn the colleges have to obey they rules. The government already has the power to control the colleges it funds. Funding tuition would not increase their power. More money does not equal more control. It is a matter of "accept our money and follow our rules" or "do not follow our rules and we will not fund you." That would not change.
@Ruupasya, very good point, I don't know, I guess I just want to try to attach updating our school curriculum into the modern Era with the issue of funding
@Ruupasya, I don't know all of it. But the math portion is definitely terrible. It isn't required, but it is a federal curriculum.
The math curriculum was created by one mathematician. He wrote a draft version, and turned it into the department of education. The bureaucrats changed it so much, that the mathematician who wrote it has testified in court multiple times that no one should ever use common core math.
@Ruupasya, to give you an idea of the idiocy of common core. Here's a question that was on last years test.
How can you make 10 out of 8+5?
That is not a trick question, and I didn't make a typo. It was not a multiple choice question either. The correct answer was to take two away from five and give it to the eight, making it 3+10. Answering "8+5=13, not 10" was incorrect.
Note: I have a masters in Applied Mathematics, and that question would have stumped me.
@talmet, The common core standards just state what students are required to learn, not how it's required to be taught. The only language I can think of about that is that students need to learn an algorithm other than the standard algorithm. That's a great thing. Rather than learning a billion formulas they'll never remember, they figure out why math works. And some students work better with non-standard algorithms than others.
One great thing that my math professor suggested was this progression:
Start with concrete. 5 hundred flats and 4 ten rods and 8 one squares plus 2 hundred flats plus 7 ten rods plus 5 one squares equals 8 hundred flats and 2 ten rods and 3 one squares.
Transition to the expanded algorithm.
500 + 40 + 8
+200 + 70 + 5
=800 + 20 + 3 = 823
Transition to the standard algorithm.
So much easier than just teaching the standard algorithm from the beginning when students are going to be like "what?"
@talmet, That's a logic question. We don't have a "logic" subject in schools. Math and logic go well together. You don't want to teach kids to think outside the box?
@Ruupasya, of course there are other ways of doing math. But if the student says that 8+5 equals 13. That shouldn't be marked wrong. On the other hand if a student says that 2+3=6 they are wrong, but in common core tests, as long as the student can come up with a reason, it's marked correct.
There are many methods to get to an answer. Pointing out different methods is good. Requiring that students use one particular method is stupid. And giving a student full credit for using the "correct" method, even if they get the wrong answer, is even more stupid.
Unfortunately, this is one category where Canada is no better than the USA.
Canadian colleges suck (in terms of expenses)
Don't forget uk, it's free here for college, but uni? That's expensive
@Bubbles5610, pretty fair loan system though. Only start paying back after you earn a decent wage, only pay back as much as you borrowed, plus plenty of opportunities for bursaries
@Bubbles5610, yes, but college is like 16-18, right? That's still high school for us.
@Ruupasya, college in the uk is any age, I see middle aged people all the time.
Countries that have put men on the moon vs countries who have not
@Death By Papercut, our education system and social programs were incredible back then compared to the rest of the world. Today we are falling behind rapidly in education, we can't stand only on the merits of the things we've done in the past but need to be constantly trying to make a better tomorrow.
@Death By Papercut,
@Death By Papercut, i have
But you can look soooo free while attending college. You can be one with nature. Mainly because you're homeless now
Only idiots who don't know all of the facts. Do some research before you make stupid things such as this.
I wanna live in Germany so badly.. Like once I get enough money, I'm taking my girlfriend :|
Also the fact that our population is much greater than theirs. So our economy cant withstand it
Something for nothing. Right folks. A dream where someone else pays your way. Go to a junior college. Work your way through. Pay as you go. Then finish at an in state college. I know several who did it with no student loans. I worked at a title one school district for five years to eliminate my masters degree debt. The key word is work. Nothing worth having is free.
But I don't want to join the military or work or pay taxes. I just want free stuff.
It's funnier if you read it in Obama's voice
Yeah, except there are countless scholarships you can utilize. So many that you can theoretically get a free ride through college if you're willing to put up the effort to search for them.
Cant get a house because my school loans are equivalent too a mortgage....
I hate the fact that the people who work their butts of to get by and need some help to get money for college can't receive it because they make "too much" money and there are people out there who do nothing to try and make money on their own and just get paid without any problems. Sorry about the rant ._. And sorry if this post is jumbled, I'm not very good at explaining what I want to say...
It's because the government helps people pay for it that college is so expensive. Well, that and the much higher demand
I'm not voting on this one, because I don't like it. It's true but I don't like it! *cries in uneducated corner*
All politicians are corrupt
I feel like I want to go to pretty much any country besides the US
This is accurate
Still, we don't have to pay large taxes like those countries. They should weigh their options and not pay 10 dollars a gallon for gas
@Tyrantrum, or liters, my bad
@Tyrantrum, near me I've got $1.74/gallon gas. I'm going to a school that, as long as you pick a hiring program, will help you find a job, and I'm expecting my field's starting wage to be 85 grand a year with raises. God bless Texas and it's desire to stay out of the people's business
@thehomage, oh really? I'm in Georgia right now, we have a state funded scholarship that covers 90% of tuition that's super easy to get. All you need is a 3.0 and its funded by the state lottery. I'm actually going to Dallas this November, can't wait to see those gas prices.
@Tyrantrum, they're higher towards the cities. I found 1.74 in new waverly, outside of Conroe
@thehomage, any attractions I should see before I leave?
@Tyrantrum, nope. Texas is horribly boring, despite it's history. Walk the Alamo if you haven't done it before, but that's pretty much it.
And if you work yourself to illness and need medication it's super expensive!