Thats why they are
D O M E S T I C
T E R R O R I S T S
@Mendicant Bias, as a MATTER OF LAW
@Mendicant Bias, *Finally Are now*
It is morally justifiable to beat the shjt out of nazis, that was basically what WW2 was about. Thank you grandpa for killing nazis!
@afewlaughs, The Nazi party back then was an immediate threat to the world. The nazis these days are just a small group of bitter assholes that are pissed that the world ignores them now because they're so irrelevant.
Also, they're not all criminals, just djcks. So no, it isn't justified to assault them. And even for the ones that are criminals, it's still not ok. It's up to the justice system to punish them.
@Weird Porn Stash, you're right, there is no legal justification for assaulting them and I'm all for hugging the hate out. However I think it's easier to stomp out a few burning embers instead of fighting a whole forest fire. Ignorance is a real threat and maybe more so now that everyone has their own publishing/distribution company (myself included). Left, right, and center we've all allowed stupid ideas to flourish, ideas that should end with a swift kick to the nuts.
@Weird Porn Stash, I would agree with the term "small group" 15 years ago. It's scary to those of us with mixed families and children to have a resurgence of hate. Especially in the South when it wasn't too long ago that some KKK aligned asshole dragged an older black man behind his truck "because".
@SchroedingerPussPuss, white supremacists and the KKK combined are less than 0.5% of the white population of the US according to FBI statistics (at one point, they had almost as many covert agents in these groups as actual members) which makes them less than four tenths of a percent of the US population.
To put it in perspective, despite over 98% of the population being straight, there are over five times as many LGBTs as there are white supremacists in the US.
@afewlaughs, I would argue that stomping out or silencing "bad" opinions is ignorance. Let them spread their bullshjt so people can see what a stupid ideology it is. Just because something is out there, doesn't mean it'll get any power.
Personally, I would even argue that trying to suppress people's opinions could give them more power. The nazis right now want attention. They don't want to fade into irelevance or be forgotten, and all this outrage people are directing to them has given them exactly what they were looking for.
@PB2, truth. For now. As something becomes more vocal and more present, it's followers will rise. It's becoming "socially acceptable" in some areas to be openly aligned with KKK/Nazi again. The worry is that in areas where there is prominent racial tension, it will become more and more mainstream. The internet example I have for this is the furries community. 20 years ago it was disgusting crazy taboo. Teens picked up the fox tail anime cat ears phase which added to the scene. Furries are still weird and they still have yiffing times/internet bashing, but it's considerably less taboo. #notafurry
@SchroedingerPussPuss, one is a growing culture because of well, the internet, which made it possible to begin with. Its not even an apples to oranges comparison, as I feel they are almost wholly incomparable.
You are aware that their membership has been declining for a century, and particularly the last 50 years, right? They aren't growing at all, and haven't in decades.
@Weird Porn Stash, it's not a "bad" opinion that one race is superior to all the others. They are wrong opinions. Maybe not wrong in the universal existential thing that there is no right or wrong only existence. But wrong in the fact that the societies of the western world came together so that the leaders of these ideas should be killed, captured, tried, and condemned. We already had the conversation years ago it's why the western world is here today living the way it does.
You're right these fringe groups want validation, whether it's persecution or a pat on the back. Bc all they need is for themselves is to feel correct.
But I think, if you want to live in a free society, we have a responsibility to our selves to correct our friends and family members when we see the embers of hate. If a stern but loving swift kick to the nuts is the vehicle, then so be it.
And if they want to run away to woods and start burning crosses then fcuk them.
@PB2, that's funny- because as a high school teacher, I'm seeing kids searching for it on the web, talking about it, and to even an extreme extent- some are coming to school with armbands. It's not like the KKK or Nazi of America list number lists or totals. When the young invest, it's a turning point for me.
@SchroedingerPussPuss, and why do you think it has become a part of discourse? Do you think they suddenly stepped up their recruitment, or do you realize that it has become a part of our recent mainstream media coverage and the aforementioned media hasn't shut up about them for weeks.
Their membership is still in perpetual decline, people are just hearing about them again because the powers that be keep mentioning them, and strawmaning the totality of their political opponents as one uniform mass of racists.
@PB2, so what you're telling me is that despite a resurgence of media attention, despite prominent attention on the interwebs and despite POSITIVE imagery from social media platforms supporting these organizations, they won't grow in numbers? That's free advertising and promotion for these organizations! I believe numbers will begin to grow. The trend is changing. I'm not saying they will take over the world, but it is a damn scary sight to see young people pursuing hate openly, and in larger numbers.
@SchroedingerPussPuss, There is one single, huge problem with all your arguments. You're making a lot of very specific, very extreme claims but not providing any actual evidence. Cities that it's become openly acceptable? Prove it. Positive imagery from social media? Prove it. Kids in school openly wearing Nazi things?! Prove. It. That one is especially impossible for me to believe.
There's also the fact that you're making some really bad arguments. The KKK guy that dragged a black man behind his truck is irrelevant. That's just one guy commuting a crime. It doesn't speak to the size or power of the KKK at all. So it's irrelevant to this discussion. You're claim that white supremacy will increase because the furries increased is, frankly, retarded. Nazism is evil and has already left a stain on mankinds history. The taboo around furries is just a pointless thing created by the prudish culture of the U.S. Furries are harmless and there's no reason to be against them. Unlike Nazism.
@Weird Porn Stash, The two are not comparable in the slightest.
@Weird Porn Stash, to be honest I'm just wasting my time providing evidence. You are set in your opinion and won't believe what I respond anyway. So here's what I've got even though it's been proven that opposing viewpoints are never changed by proof. The overall number of U.S. hate groups jumped about 17 percent in 2016 from 784 in 2014 to 917 groups according to non-profit Southern Poverty Law Center research. If you don't believe in SPLC, believe in FBI reports that show there has been a 67% increase in hate based attacks on Muslims in just a few years... generally by WHITE Americans. The black man James Byrd Jr dragged behind a car in Texas was dragged by THREE white men, not just one. The A&M coach just received massive amounts of hateful, race inspired threats to his home 2 days ago FOR LOSING A FOOTBALL GAME. Cypress Ranch HS had photos of entire classes showing the Nazi salute in support of Trump (not necessarily Nazis, but stepping stone for it to be OK).
@Weird Porn Stash, and I can't show pictures or provide proof of my students who wear Nazi armbands on campus. NO teacher or admin can. It's a violation of FERPA. All I can give is anecdotal evidence that I *hope* others will believe. I can vouch that anecdotes are not valid, but would hope the rest of the world would take into account that things are changing, but NOT for the better
Hey man, if you're not in support of murdering millions in the name of communism, then you must support murdering millions because they're Jews. No one could possibly believe that mass murder is always unjustifiable.
@ReeseBobby, this is the argument that bugs me most. People think political leanings are a line, with fascism on the far right and communism on the far left, but there's a compass. A planar graph. Left, right, up, and down.
@ReeseBobby, Hey! Don't you know better?! It IS okay to commit mass murder against [insert group here]! They're the BAD guys!
I don't really think it's okay to hit anyone, unless it's self defense or to protect someone who hasn't done anything wrong. Just keep your hands to yourself, I don't see why that's so hard.
@The white dude, Probably because you're a white dude/s
When you want to impeach Trump but didn't vote against him to start with
@Medic135, that's because convicted felons can't vote
Gotta love oxymorons. Too bad anybody affiliated with this group doesn't know what an oxymoron is. Probably because they have social degrees
@AN AMERICAN, Are you affliated with this group? Because this isn't an oxymoron.
@AN AMERICAN, That's not an oxymoron. That's just a vicious cycle of stupidity and ignorance.
@Pythio, haha that's great
@Pythio, red-black are the colors of anarcho-communism. If you'd like a 3 paragraph explanation on why it's an oxymoron let me know. I thought the name speaks for itself really
@Ze Grammar Nazi, "Anarcho-Communism" is absolutely an oxymoron.
"Social justice terrorists"
I mean as far as I've seen so far antifa's violence has be reactive, and more importantly against actual nazi. just sayin'
@Beede, no, it's been against mostly libertarians and conservatives...
People just want to point to the handful of people doing sieg heils and pretend that they're all Nazis, because it's a convenient excuse.
@Doctor Krieger, I don't know man usually when I see bunch of people march throwing seig heils, wearing KKK outfits, shouting kill the Jews they generally aren't libertarians or conservatives, but maybe you're right there must be some sensible and logical explanation as to why they'd want pretend to be Nazis if they weren't in fact Nazis
@Beede, and now we're already at the point in the conversation where you're just entirely making shìt up.
It doesn't help your cause to be constantly fùcking lying.
@Doctor Krieger, um? It's highly documented, literally videotaped. If you want to deny evidence be my guest but that is exactly what happened.
@Beede, one single instance of them getting into it with white supremacists. Look up Antifa in Cal Berkeley, UC Davis, Portland, Seattle.
They hit innocent people in the head with bike locks for attending a rally where there will be a "conservative" speaker.
If you think they are actually fighting Nazis, you're not paying attention.
@big freedom, you're right, but are you not also just cherry picking a few of their protest where they were the aggressors? In the same way you claim people cherry pick the Nazis to paint conservatives as Nazis?
@Beede, if you donate $1M to a church every year, but rape a single child - you're a fûcking rapist.
If you fight a few jack-àss white supremacists, but hit innocent people for attending a political rally - you're a fûcking terrorist.
@big freedom, and if you ally yourself with a Nazi you are a nazi
@Beede, again a single instance. And yes the people who were there claiming to be Nazis are white supremacist or Nazi or whatever. People who came to stand up for free speech and fight Antifa, are NOT Nazis.
Are you saying that since you seem to be siding with Antifa that you are in fact a terrorist?
@big freedom, I wouldn't say I'm with antifa I would agree they have on occasion gone too far, my argument is they aren't just accusing people of being fascist/nazi willy nilly, and if that makes me a terrorist sure I'm a terrible terrible terrorist
@Beede, do you not see the contradiction in your statements? "If you associate with..."
Yes they do attack willy nilly. Have you looked up the examples I pointed out earlier (not from CNN source!) they literally - and I'm using that word correctly - attacked innocent bystanders for coming to the aid of a wheel chair bound veteran.
I'm not asking what your opinion is of Antifa - I really don't give a shît - I'm telling you that they are violent terrorists by every definition of the word.
The more they go looking for a fight, unfortunately they will find it. And it's only unfortunate because the media will tell morons that the "anti Nazi protestors were attacked" even through they absolutely started it.
While they are stupid, they are still better than Nazis, KKK and white supremacists.
@iOS10, how so? Communists have dwarved every other group combined in genocide. AntiFa are communists and explicitly so.
@iOS10, by death toll, perhaps. By economic damage and ruined economies, certainly.
As far as being an overall even decent or passable ideology? Hell fvcking no.
@Doctor Krieger, their primary goal is to stop white supremacists. While I don't like there violent actions, I feel their overall goal is a positive one. And one that is better than the overall goals of White Supremacists, Nazis and the KKK.
@iOS10, dude, this just shows to me how completely clueless you are. AntiFa have been primarily concerned with overthrowing capitalism since they were founded. "Opposing racism" is just an excuse. Most of the people they're assaulting aren't even racial identitarians of any kind.
It's about advancing their violent and oppressive ideology using the hysteria of a moral panic as a vehicle. This is how black bloc tactics have always worked, even before AntiFa was a thing.
@Doctor Krieger, sorry, but we just disagree on which piece of sh!t is the better piece of sh!t.
@iOS10, most of the people AntiFa harms aren't pieces of shìt, though. There simply are not hordes of white identitarians roaming the streets like there are hordes of AnComs. The people AntiFa assaults are mostly libertarians, conservatives, and classical liberals.
It's not about which piece of shìt smells worse, it's about what the largest piece of shìt is doing right now, why they are doing it, and how they are getting away with it.
If Nazis were marching the streets like AntiFa assaulting people to advance fascism and getting away with it because the government and media tacitly defend them, I would be focused on Nazis. It's AnComs doing that right now, however.
@Doctor Krieger, all I am saying is that in the fight between the group of white supremacists, kkk and Nazis and the group of Antifa. I root for Antifa to win. Nothing more. Nothing less.
@iOS10, it's a fight between AntiFa and anyone who isn't them, though. The Nazi boogeyman is just an excuse for their violence.
Remember, "liberals get the bullet too".
@Doctor Krieger, oy vey. Stop moving the goal posts to fit your agenda. I give one scenario and you give back multiple. I'm not comparing any other scenarios. If you want to, start another thread with other people who like to change the statements so that it fits their own agenda.