Comments
-
@sbcarp, thank you
-
@sbcarp, very interesting. You happen to remember where you read this so I can indulge myself?
-
Also the ones that weren’t going to capitulate like Germany did
-
@The nOly One, Seriously. It sounds horrible (and it is) but the US systematically burned every major Japanese city pretty much to the ground in sequence and the hard bastards still wouldn't surrender
-
@Yourself, and to top it off, the mass sucides after their surrender.
-
@AtomicWolf, Which is a good indication to prove they weren't really as eager to surrender upon the rise of the Soviets as most people think. And to those people who claim the Soviet threat reduced the nukes to overkill, you may be right, but consider: At the time, the Japanese were still bent on the idea of "ketsu-go," an honorable final battle to the end. Whether against America or Russia, they were willing to suffer this fate, or at least so America assumed. At the very least, they were willing to weather literal firestorms for a chance to make it happen. But the nukes proved to everyone that ketsu-go wasn't coming. Suddenly cities weren't just burning, they were disappearing in a flash. So without the ability to at least save honor in a final stand, the orderliness of the Japanese population finally broke and high command caved under the strain of refugees fleeing to the countryside. https://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2016/08/06/commentary/japan-surrender-world-war-ii
-
@Yourself, I actually disagree with that article on a couple points, firstly, Ketsu-go was already a point of disagreement between the Japanese military sects. While some favored the idea of retaining honor by continuing the fight in the homeland, others were coming to realize that the war would likely mean subjugation of Japan politically. In essence the more forward thinking industry leaders would rather surrender before the USSR got involved and Japan was split, like Germany. So there was already a lot of discourse revolving around surrender before the nukes were dropped. Secondly it wasn’t just the threat the soviets take part in the war on the Japanese mainland, it was its colonies that worried the Kwantung army and the Japanese political ministers. Japan got a massive amount of its food from Manchukuo and a lot of its industrial resources like metals from Korea. When the Soviet’s got involved they literally bowled over Manchukuo in less than two weeks.
-
@Spetsnaz , (continued) while many in the Army (primarily Doug MacArthur) wanted to conduct an invasion of the home islands, some in the navy preferred a blockade. With the promise of Soviet capture of Japanese colonies in Manchuria and Korea (which did happen, but between Hiroshima and Nagasaki) Japan would essentially have a massive food shortage that would likely have brought the government to the table to surrender. Furthermore, Stalin has promised Roosevelt his assistance in an eventual invasion of Japan. As Truman took power he had no relationship with Stalin (while FDR knew Stalin was brutal, they had a working relationship) and was worried by proposed Soviet involvement in an invasion of Japan. So I tend to think the Nukes were partially Truman kicking off the Cold War, and partially trying to avoid a blockade or invasion. Personally I think it been less destructiveto show the nukes to Japanese officials after a few months of blockade. But there’s no point in what ifs.
-
Hi frands, I'm from Japan and I'd like you all to know that in Japanese schools, the history is taught differently than it is in other countries :D
-
@Kounat, go on... very curious about how WWII is taught in Japan!
-
@Kounat, please do go on. Im very interested
-
@Kounat, you can't leave us like this now
-
@Hallucinated corpse, Oh sht Im sorry, I have notifications turned off and didn't even see these comments lol In short, Japan believes they did nothing wrong and it was every other country at fault. They had nothing to do with WWII and most schools don't even acknowledge Pearl Harbor at all, it's just entirely focused on the USA's bombings. In all honesty.. Japan acts as if a lot of the dark past never happened. What happened in China as well... they speak briefly of it, if at all, and then move on to who's to blame (from other countries) for anything that's happened. It's kinda weird and uncomfortable for many to even speak on these subjects.
-
@Kounat, sounds exactly what's being taught in every other country : "we are innocent. We are brave. We fought evil"
-
This one comes second to QUAD DESK!
No one ever talks about how the a bombs were a deterrent to the Soviets as well. There was every indication that Stalin was prepared to sweep over western Europe all the way to the Atlantic. The a bombs in Japan made his superior numbers count for nothing and became the only reason that they didn't push the war further