Have seen a lot of that lately...
@seeUpee, So you're saying you wanna do a road trip?
@seeUpee, in your Fiat? But, where would we put our stuff? Maybe... if you sit on my lap?
@seeUpee, ? You mean Kenosha? The thugs (aka "demonstrators") in Portland still aren't getting what they deserve as far as I'm aware.
@seeUpee, In that case let's rent a Smart Car.
@Captain Swordsman, bUt THeY arE peAcEfuL prOTeSTerS
@spongeblade, Not to start a whole thing; as someone who lives in Seattle, they are being peaceful.
@MrTuxPenguin, well I haven't followed Seattle too closely, but in Portland they are 100% terrorists. If you watch the video of the guy that was shot and killed in Portland, guy walks up yells "he's a Trumper, we got a Trumper over here!" Bang bang the guy is dead. So maybe in some places there are peacefule protests, but to deny the fact that there are organizations using these protests to incite violence is ignorant at best. Also, BLM and antifi openly state that they are Marxists and their group charters have little to do with racism, and more to do with political change in the US to marxism.
@DiSoNeGuY, it would be illegal for me to cross state lines with what I have. I'll just sit on the very top of my roof, which is flat, at the top of the hill, and blow a hole through their engine from two blocks away.
@spongeblade, these "protests" need to stop completely. I'm white, my next door neighbor is black, and we both agree on this. All they do is fuel anger from both sides. Idiots burning down their own neighborhood isn't helping anything. I even told him that if shjt really goes down, he, and his wife and young kid are welcome into my 3 layer brick house for protection. I let him borrow my tools and shjt like that, like any neighbor would. I'm sick of this white vs. black thing going on. I make damn good money, and I have black friends that make more than I do. Everyone needs to just shut the hell up and improve their own lives and stop worrying about everyone else. This can be said for a lot of things, not just whatever pretend "race war" that is going on
@Not him again, i agree, im sick of everything being about race. There's obviously going to be 1 or 2 random racist pos people out there, but everything I've seen and have been a part of is like you and your neighbor, peaceful Americans living together. This "race war" has nothing to do with race and everything to do with the dirtiest politics possible. People are dying over demonstrable lies that our corrupt media propagates. BLM got widespread recognition during the 2016 election, then they disappeared for 3 years only to reappear right as the 2020 election kicked into full swing. Plus a lot of the "oppressive businesses" and communities they attack and destroy are predominantly black. If the really care about helping black people, they wouldn't destroy so many black lives. The violence needs to end and let peaceful discourse resume.
@spongeblade, is there a problem with shooting a trump worshipper?
@Krypteia, yes its called cold blooded murder because you're too pathetic to think somebody else can can have a different viewpoint. Doesn't matter if it was a trump supporter or a Biden supporter, to murder somebody like that is pure evil. Past that they didn't even really hold a high standard. It was a simple as somebody else saying "he's a trumper". If you don't see the problem with that you should reevaluate your morals.
@spongeblade, sorry, I just saw so many people holding Kyle Rittenhouse up as a hero for murdering people that I thought this was just what people do now
@spongeblade, I don’t know where you’re getting the “they said he’s a trumper and then shot him”. I’ve read a lot of articles on the incident and never read that. Probably just more alt-right lies and fear mongering
@Not him again, (whispers quietly in your ear) that’s their whole point. They don’t want a solution. They want a fight to tear it all down. If people capitulate and give them “what they want” they will just move the goalposts in order to continue the fight.
The only way to make this stop is to actually fight back.
@Krypteia, *defend himself against violence. He murdered nobody.
@spongeblade, Ohhh this blew up more than what I wanted. I do want to see the video you mentioned about the protesters shooting the Trump supporter. And no doubt, there are people in the protests that are they to incite violence. But there are also plenty of videos of protesters (in Portland a as well) calmly and peacefully marching. But the big picture shouldn’t be lost, we need reform. Major reform. In the police, and government.
@Not him again, Hi. So I really want to talk about this with real people. No BS or anything. I know you’re nit racist, but have you asked your neighbor if he’s ever been discriminated against? If he feels safe from the police?
I really am not trying to start anything. I just want real people’s opinion.
@big freedom, what would you do if you saw someone shoot and kill someone? Would you try to stop them from shooting again?
@MrTuxPenguin, everyone has been discriminated against by the opposite race (and sometimes the same race) at some point in their life. Like @spongeblade said, we need to stop making everything about race
@Not him again, Everyone has yes. But to varying degrees. I can’t say the N word (racist?). But I’ve never feared for my life because of my skin color.
@MrTuxPenguin, I've had guns shoved in my face several times by cops, gotten "pulled over" while parked by the police who illegally searched me and my vehicle while handcuffed to the push bar of their car, then vigorously interrogated and threatened. It's not about skin color, its a few bad cops that makes all of them look bad.
@Not him again, Your anecdotal evidence doesn’t really prove your point
@Krypteia, tell me where I'm wrong then
@Not him again, Then maybe we should tighten down on cops. You know, crack down on bad cops. Maybe, give them less money even.
I’m assuming you’re white. But bad cops get off by showing dominance over others. And who better to dominate than a group of people who have been looked down upon and stepped on for hundreds of years?
@Krypteia, Anecdotal evidence is still evidence. No matter how small. (Personal opinion).
@Krypteia, for Kyle Rittenhouse, he went there to give medical assistance to both sides. He clearly defended himself. There is a video of the shooting where he is running away and doesn't shoot the guy "until" the guy draws another gun and is actively raising it to shoot Kyle. I don't know about the first guy Kyle shot but from what I've seen that was likely self defense as well. Because there was a 3rd guy he could have shot but the guy raised his hands, no gun, and backed up. Also for the "out of state" thing, Kyle lives about 30 minutes across the state line from what I've heard and he works in Kenosha. So while it is technically "across state lines" he wasnt going out of his way to do something bad. He drove there to help people.
@MrTuxPenguin, honestly the best source I've found is Steven Crowder on YouTube. He can be a bit loud mouthed and I don't agree with him on everything. But he has very clear sources and is the only one who shows the entire videos of the shooting. He also has several videos where he walks through the areas of the protests and talks to the people on the street. If you're looking for the vids on major news sites you probably won't find them as our national media is a joke. Most of the real news only the smaller outlets will show and even then, the ones that do will often get shut down/censored.
@MrTuxPenguin, I've said multiple times that I'm white. How about you read all of my comments instead of cherry pick.
Should we crack down on bad cops, definitely. Should we defund them, absolutely not.
@spongeblade, Thank you. I agree, the news here is bias and irresponsible.
I’m glad you suggested someone you don’t totally agree with. To many people just confirm their own bias.
@Krypteia, if you're watching CNN, CBS, abc, most of Fox, then I can see why you've never seen the actual facts. John Oliver is also just as bad if not worse. Most all of the major news outlets are outright lying about what's going on and if you look outside of their blanket, its easy to see just how dishonest they are. An always great example is the "reporters" saying this is a peaceful protest as building burn down behind them. The media doesn't care about the facts, they only care about their narrative of Orange man bad.
@MrTuxPenguin, youtube.com/watch?v=s61drCqB-hl is the link to the podcast. If you go the about the 12 minute mark is where the video is if you want to see it. Lmk if the link doesn't work and ill try and repost.
@spongeblade, So I looked him up. He is 100% conservative. (Opinion). But he contributed to FOX news and had his YouTube channel demonetized for homophobic slurs. (Wikipedia)
If I can suggest someone who’s more center (he leans left more) Some More News with Cody Johnson. Any of his videos.
@spongeblade And I don’t mean that being conservative is a bad thing that I won’t listen to, but he cites Fox News, which you’ve said is unreliable, and doesn’t bring up (what I think) are obvious link. Ex. He mentioned that the MFF bailed out someone who was arrested for having a gun in a public place, but never mentioned that Kyle Ritterhouse did the same thing and the police let him by. This is from his Biden Campaign Funds Violent Riots! Posted today on his YouTube.
Also, very one sided title. (Opinion).
@MrTuxPenguin, I looked into that, his demonetization was 100% political. He has several videos about the demo itization and YouTube is just banning him because he's conservative as they've done to several people. Google is 100% guilty of censorship. I'm not a fan of some of his comments, and he is conservative. But his arguments are still pretty well sourced and he's the only one to show the videos. Don't look at articles about Crowder, watch his videos and make up your mind for yourself. I ignored him for a while because of what I heard about him, but after watching several of his podcasts he's far more reliable than most of our "media" outlets imo because of his sources.
@MrTuxPenguin, I wouldnt use Wikipedia for anything political btw. Its run by hard left people that edit things to promote their ideology. A good example is the wiki page on Trump reads like a CNN article.
@spongeblade, I’ll watch a couple of his videos. In the middle of one right now as previously mentioned.
But what about him contributing to Fox News? And where is the evidence of Wikipedia and Google being liberal companies that censor more conservative channels? I’d like to see more.
@MrTuxPenguin, the one titled "antifa murders trump supporter in portland" is the one I linked and it shows the portland shooting and he discusses Kyle a bit more in depth. I haven't seen that one you mentioned as it was just posted today it looks like.
@MrTuxPenguin, as to him being a fox contributer, I dont think that really matters. Its like me hating Google but using it to search for stuff. I know its biased, but there isn't many great alternatives. So crowder does source Fox sometimes, but he also sources cnn ABC etc because there are 6 (i think) major media companies that run our "news". He tries to use first hand accounts when they're available.
@MrTuxPenguin, as to the bias, there were leaked audio tapes of Google executives stating they want to use their platform to change the election results to get rid of Trump. Google also banned a lot of conservative gaming channels because they criticized Sony/naughty dog for the last of us 2 leaks. "Just some guy" and "geeks and gamers" were the 2 I saw that discussed their own strikes. Google also created project dragonfly which directly helped the Chinese government implement widespread digital conceorship in China. A recent house hearing had Zuckerberg, Bezos, Pichai (google ceo) and a couple other big tech ceos. During the hearing one of the congress members referenced a report ( I dont remember who exactly but it was a high ranking us intelligence person) where google helped build Chinese weapons while declining to help build defensive systems for the us.
@MrTuxPenguin, i can't cite off the top of my head Wikipedia, mostly just whenever I read anything on there related to politics I notice all of the buzz words that CNN uses. Recently (if I remember right) there was an article i saw saying BLM did some event where they went through and "fixed" racial history for a bunch of posts.
@MrTuxPenguin, your opinion is wrong. Anecdotal evidence is worthless
@spongeblade, I don’t know if I should reply to each post or address it all in one. But...
1. Kyle Ritterhouse: That was a bad situation overall. I believe he did go there to stop the protesters because he listens to Fox and was scared of the place where he worked being burned down. And in the video, I didn’t see anyone else having a gun except him, but they were scared because they listen to CNN about Trump supporters being violent.
2. It matters a lot if he contributed to Fox. They’re on the same team. They have the same goals. The only times he cites ABC CNN etc is to make fun of them and say they’re lying with no evidence. I haven’t seen any 1st hand accounts yet.
3. I would like the Google tapes. If you have a link that would be nice. Because that’s a big allegation.
4. As with Wikipedia, they’ve gotten their stuff together since the early ‘00.
5. Also those channels are still up. Just checked. Monetized even.
@Krypteia, Ok. But factually speaking, just saying “your wrong” isn’t a persuasive argument and you shouldn’t be taken seriously. At all. By anyone.
@spongeblade, So I found a video by a non big news channel (the good ones we like) disproving Crowder.
There’s the link. I’d love to discuss it with you.
@MrTuxPenguin, for the youtube channels they are still up because they had to fight youtube about it. It was back in like march/april. For the Google tapes were in like 2017 and Google fought hard to quiet them down so it would take a bit to find those. I think it was Breitbart reporter that got them if you want to look for them. You can also look for the house hearing like a month ago with all the big tech executives, it discusses quite a bit of that stuff. Its a long/kinda boring video, but that is worth watching.
For Kyle Rittenhouse I just found a nytimes article that is actually decent. It has the videos/photos that show kyle was shot at first, chased by people clearly holding guns, and he shoots after he's tackled to the ground and somebody with a gun is rushing him. nytimes.com/2020/08/27/us/kyle-rittenhouse-kenosha-shooting-video.html
I can't speak to everything prior to the shootings as there isn't really enough evidence that I think is conclusive. Though there is some.
@spongeblade, So I found a video by a non big news channel (the good ones we like) disproving Crowder.
There’s the link. I’d love to discuss it with you.
It also mentioned that YouTube isn’t as far left as you’ve suggested.
@MrTuxPenguin, 8 watched most of that video and while I agree it was inappropriate and I dont stand by Crowders jokes, but I think mocking somebody isnt harassment. The doxing is but I don't think there is any evidence that directly linked crowder to that. Like anybody there is good and bad. Bill Marr talking about pretty much any conservative or Christians is pretty hateful imo, but I've seen some stuff I agree with him on. Regardless of agreeing/liking what is said by anybody, fre speech protects "hate speech" because whats hateful just depends which side you're on.
The thought slime guy kinda contradicts himself by saying Crowder has a right to free speech, but shouldn't be allowed on youtube. Youtube pretends its an open platform for all sides. The second youtube begins to remove videos/channels because they don't like something they cease to be an open platform.
@spongeblade, Unfortunately free speech does protect hate speech. But what Thought Slime was saying was that according to YouTube, they (YouTube) will take down your video if they deem it harassment. Weather or not it was harassment is up for debate. But they didn’t take it down because YouTube is “liberal”.
YouTube has never been an open platform. They’ve taken down tons of videos that violate they’re terms. From porn to beheadings and such.
@MrTuxPenguin, i would say that porn/beheadings/terrorist videos are another discussion. And I'm pretty sure they did take down the videos, crowder sued them and won from what I understand. And youtube determining what is harassment is a problem because they can deem whatever they dislike as harassment. Such as any criticism for the BLM movement being unjustly called racist/harassment/hate speech etc. The thought slime video seemed more just the guys opinion and he didn't really cite much of anything specific that I noticed.
Youtube is an open platform when they say anybody can come and voice their opinion on here and upload what you want. Thats how its been from the beginning. If you think Google isn't a bias liberal company id encourage you to look into it. A place to start would be Breitbart. Google manipulated their searches to cause Breitbarts viewership to drop drastically after the last election. Google is a strongly liberal company. They openly support most liberal causes.
@spongeblade, Can’t find any results to the Crowder vs YouTube problem.
But it’s YouTube is Google’s property. They can make the rules whatever they want. The 1st amendment says you can say whatever you like. It doesn’t say that companies need to support it.
Also what do you define as harassment? Because name calling, doxing, and laughing at a minority (gay) is harassment.
And Amazon started out as selling books. Things change and as YouTube grew, it did become a place where people were posting more edgy videos. I personally remember that. But then they made the decision to do the socially responsible thing and to take a stand against hate speech. Left or right winged.
As for YouTube being leftist, the Thought Slime guy pointed out a few left wing channels that didn’t have the money to sue to get their channel back. He was making the case that YouTube is right leaning actually.
And what are the liberal causes exactly?
@spongeblade, For Kyle Ritterhouse, the video is of the 2nd shooting they report. The crowd was chasing him because he shot someone. (You can hear them saying “he shot someone”). I can say for what happened before that, but the guy with the gun 1. Didn’t shoot. 2. Was chasing someone who had already discharged their weapon. He was trying to be the hero too.
OPINION: I think Kyle shouldn’t of been there at all. I think the cops should of stopped him instead of encouraging him. And I feel bad for everyone involved. Including Kyle. He seems like he was trying to do what what’s right. But you know what they say about the road to hell...
@MrTuxPenguin, sorry, I figured most people already knew anecdotal evidence was worthless, guess not. Anecdotal evidence is worthless because, it usually incorporates bias, it’s unverifiable, it can easily be distorted, it can easily be fictitious, and there’s no accompanying evidence to support it. “I was once beaten to the brink of death by a game show host when I failed to recognize him at a store.” Do you believe me?
@MrTuxPenguin, For the Crowder case there isnt a ton of stuff public since its a legal case. The most ive seen is Crowder discuss it in some of his videos and there was an article about it on Vox I think. With the 1st amendment people have a right to free speech and companies have the right to jot support stuff 100%. But Google is a monopoly as they're larger then some governments with a net worth. Google has a market share of about 1.3 trillion. Russia has a gdp of 1.66 trillion to give an idea. At that size google must be held to a higher standard and they don't get to pick and choose who they like. On and individual level people working for google can do whatever, but not as a representative of google. The google executives were trying to make the Trump presidency "a blip in history".
For harassment id just use the dictionary definition: aggressive pressure or intimidation. Criticism and saying stuff about somebody on youtube is different. Crowder said some cringe worthy stuff
@spongeblade, but he never tried to harm the guy. Most of the liberals I see pretend that if they're criticized then its a violent attack. For liberal causes its pretty much anything the DNC advocates. But examples they've spoken about are: opposing Trumps immigration policies, Trumps travel ban (same bans Obama and Clinton did), they oppenly supported Hillary in 2016. For Kyle I agree it shouldn't have been there, but he didn't shoot first. The article I linked show somebody else fire before Kyle shot the first person. Though that whole timeline isn't extremely clear from any angle so I think people need to stop rushing to judgement. The 2nd shooting is 100% clear self defense. He was there to help people he knew defend their property. There arent any hard numbers, but the estimates of property damages ive heard range in the billions for the "protests". I dont remember which city, but one of the "protests" was a bunch of thugs looting a mall. Kyle went to stop that from happening.
@MrTuxPenguin, as the the fact the guy with the gun "didn't shoot". Who cares? If somebody is charging you with a gun in a mob, if you wait for him to shoot first then you're dead. If you have a drawn gun, chase somebody down, they have a right to shoot you in self defense. The i didn't shoot the gun argument doesnt matter. Gunfights are over in seconds and you don't have the time or ability to read somebody's mind if theyre gonna shoot or not. Rule is, don't draw a gun unless you intend to use it. So the reciprocal goes as well, if somebody draws a gun on you, assume they intend to shoot you. It's a crappy situation from all angles, but these "protests" need to end. These "protests" have (depending on where you look) body counts of 15-30 or more people dead. That blood is on the hands of BLM and antifa because they are the ones creating these situations.
@Krypteia, saying "I was once...." is not anecdotal evidence, its firsthand experience and it is extremely valid. If the person is proven to be a liar with demonstrable evidence, that disproves the claims and proves the first hand experience false.
@spongeblade, so if someone shot and killed someone at Walmart and a group of people rushed the shooter to stop them, would the shooter be legally justified to shoot the group of people? Thankfully Kyle will most likely serve prison time for trying to be a vigilante
@spongeblade, anecdotal evidence is personal testimony, which is exactly what I gave. I’m sorry you aren’t able to actually refute my comment with honesty
@Krypteia, It is. But there’s a reason why we still interview people.
And most biases can be found out using logic and critical thinking.
I don’t believe you because that would be a stupid move by the game show host.
@spongeblade, I think we can all agree though that we’re all much better off now that that alt-right trump worshipper was killed in Portland. Just a few million more to go
@MrTuxPenguin, can you prove I’m lying?
@Krypteia, a few million more to go? Evil pos like you are the problem in this country. Every life matters, black lives matter, white lives matter, Latino, Democrat, republic, whatever. Even if you're just saying that as a "troll" comment you need to reevaluate your morals.
@spongeblade, nah, I’ve heard enough trump worshippers praising Kyle Rittenhouse for murdering those guys so I’ve completely lost any concern I might have had for the alt-right people.
@Krypteia, if you actually care about the truth (which I doubt) go read the article i posted. What started the fight is yet unknown. But what is known is that Kyle was being chased, somebody (not Kyle) shot for some unknown reason, then Kyle turned around and fired back. That was the first person Kyle shot. The second was after the group continued to pursue Kyle with guns. So to use your crappy analogy, if a group of thugs shot at somebody and he returned fire in self defense, then ran to Walmart, he would be justified in shooting at the mob of people who are yelling "get his ass" (while holding guns). themselves)
@Krypteia, and that belief is why you are an immoral piece of human filth. But, even though I say that I would still advocate against anybody doing you physical harm. I hope you grow up one day.
@spongeblade, “Don’t draw a gun unless you intend to use it”. So what do you say about a guy (not a cop yet) showing up with a rifle. Do you think he intended to use it?
And what’s the body count of racists killing innocent black people?
For the Crowder case, can’t say much because it’s not public. But listening to an involved party is biased.
Google is a monopoly (close enough) and they do need to be held to a higher standard. That’s a liberal thought. But who’s gonna force them? Because they won’t do it themselves.
For harassment: Crowder was aggressive (verbally). He was intimidating. He was tormenting. It doesn’t have to be physical. He did harm him mentally.
The Dems have been around before Trump. They have their own ideals. (I only bring it up because for Dem ideals you only mentioned that they oppose Trump). Also, f*ck the Clintons.
The Second video he was acting in self defense. It’s unclear what happened before. There is no 1st shooting video and the picture doesn’t count
@spongeblade, How can we agree so much on this but have SUCH different political views?!
@spongeblade, well, at least it’s now clear you haven’t actually seen any videos of the incident
@spongeblade, what if someone murders someone else and I try to stop them and get killed in the process? By your immoral logic my death would be 100% justified
@spongeblade, your apparent love of Breitbart shows you don’t actually care about truth
@MrTuxPenguin, possession of a gun is not drawing it. The first shooting i think we both agree we need to wait for more info. The picture does count, but as I said before its not conclusive. There was an entire car lot burnt to the grou d the day prior to the shooting. So Kyle (and others evidently) showed up to defend the business of somebody they knew. Thats the same as hiring bodyguards when you have a death threat. Since it was just stuff I agree it wasn't a good idea to go, but that still wasn't initiating a gun fight. The police told Kyle to leave and he was compliant and left. The fight started shortly after that (for a yet unknown reason).
For google, I agree monopoly busting is a traditional liberal value, but i think its a good thing in some instances like big tech, and its a good example of dems-republicans finding common ground. Hard to say how to enforce them, thats a bigger discussion than I think we can have on here, but my fist thought would be to look at Teddy R.
@spongeblade, too bad Kyle had an illegal firearm
@MrTuxPenguin, for the body counts, I dont think there is a "body count of racist killing". At least not anything systemic or widespread. The closest thing I've seen to that is BLM who openly advocates for violence against police simply because they're police. About 1k people die to police each year, 54% white, like 32% or so black. The argument there is that black deaths is disproportionate to the population of about 13% black in th US. But then you also need to look at crime rates where black people make up 38% of violent crime. Source: ojjdp and northeastern uni study. I think that is a good issue to discuss, but I dont see enough evidence to say its racially motivated (at least by police) and there are other underlying issues we need to find out about.
@MrTuxPenguin, lastly (I think) i think we just disagree on harassment. Krypteia said he would like to see millions of right wing people dead. That could be considered harassment based of what it looks like you're saying. I despise what he said but I dont think thats harassment (unless he acts on those statements). He can say whatever he wants however stupid/evil it is but i dont think it should be banned. Once he acts on those ideas and tries to go after people, thats harassment (or worse based off what he said). For Crowder he criticized and mocked the guy, but when I saw Crowder discuss the guy he explicitly said he does not want physical harm or violence which is why I think he stays in the category of protected free speech and not harassment. If he made a call to action to go after the guy or did it himself then id agree he should be banned.
@spongeblade, as for you and I, I think we agree on common American ideals outlined in the constitution. I think our disagreements are less than you think, we just have different starting points on what happened. But feom what I can tell once all facts are truly known you and I might agree on a bit more than you'd think.
Note: I've enjoyed having this discussion with you as its rare ( at least for me) to find people that disagree and are willing to have a peaceful discussion. Most people i see (online) are trash like krypteia who resort to wanting people they don't like dead.
@spongeblade, Except that he (Kyle) wasn’t hired. No one knew why he was there, and he had a rifle out ready to use. You and me can think about this critically, but to scared protesters, he was out for blood.
For the burned lot, I’m not saying the riots are justified. This is what happens when people feel like they don’t have a voice. As you mentioned, the BLM movement started in 2016 and there has been no progress. And now with the virus out, minorities have been hit the hardest. AND they have to worry about cops now? It’s enough to break anyone.
There should be some common ground between D’s and R’s. But both parties absolutely refuse to listen let alone compromise with each other.
I also couldn’t find ANYTHING about Breitbaet and google.
@Krypteia, I would suggest looking at the New York Times article spongeblade posted.
@MrTuxPenguin, nice article. It didn’t disprove anything I said, but it was nice
@Krypteia, So you saw Kyle running from some guys yea? That’s the 2nd shooting. That’s all we were talking a about. Anything before that is here say.
@MrTuxPenguin, I’m talking about the second guy he killed. It’s only logical that if people see a random guy who had been strutting around with an illegal gun shoot someone then they would rush to stop him. The “mob” didn’t charge him until he had actually killed someone. I can’t speak for the first death, but I’d say the second guy killed was acting more in self defense (and bravery) than Kyle was
@Krypteia, if you can't speak for the first death then why do you keep insisting Kyle didnt defend himself there too? Point is we don't know what truly happened at first and you keep passing judgement by saying its ok for the mob to chase him. Its entirely possible they attacked him first and when he defended himself that made them go after him harder forcing him to defend himself a second time.
@Krypteia, Yea that’s what I’m saying. I can’t say for the 1st shooting, but in the video you hear someone say “he shot someone”. Weather it was in self defense or not ehhh. But the video (the 2nd shooting) they rushed him. And I don’t blame them.
@spongeblade, by all accounts the first person he killed ran towards him and threw a plastic bag, of what I don’t know, then when he was killed a group of people chased after Kyle, because he just killed someone. Then he tripped and a guy with a skateboard tried to incapacitate him but ended up getting killed. Kyle should never have been there, illegally carried the gun, did not have the proper training and ended up killing two people because of it
@MrTuxPenguin, then we’re in agreement
@MrTuxPenguin, i think our disagreement is the BLM movement. I think that BLM is a terrorist organization that doesn't really care about black people but sees it as a useful tool to institute a Marxist revolution. The founders of BLM are open Marxist who were mentored by very far left people such as Eric Mann who was a part of a group(students for democratic society) responsible for bombing a townhouse. BLM claims they're for social justice for Black people, but they've done more damage to black communities than anything the police have done in recent years. I think BLM just uses that as a lie to pro.ote Marxism. And that fear mongering is no justification for the damage and makes caused by BLM. From what I know MLK protests never had widespread violence and he fought for peace, BLM is fighting for blood. If we really want to help black communities it comes by fixing the school and financial systems in black communities. And more, better police.
@spongeblade, you said that right. BLM and Antifa are exactly what are causing these problems. Also right in saying not to pull a gun unless you intend to use it. I carry, and I hope to God or whoever that it never leaves the holster unless I'm at the range. I live in St. Louis city, in one of the best neighborhoods still left, and even before all this shjt started happening, I caught two black (yes I said it) guys breaking into my truck in the grocery store parking lot. They sped off in their getaway car, but I got the plate number and called the police. Of course it was stolen. That just goes to show how bold people can be. That was the broken straw that pushed me to actually start carrying.
I couldn't care less what color your skin is, if you are doing something you should not. I dunno what is going on with here. I definitely don't, but with all crazies now, regardless of skin color
@MrTuxPenguin, youtube.com/watch?v=1noLh25FbKl is the video of one of the BLM founders stating they're trained marxists.
@spongeblade, trump worshippers keep claiming that this is all done by marxists and socialists, which is it?
@MrTuxPenguin, think of it this way. You neighbors house is burnt down by hundreds of angry people who you have nothing to do with and they say they're coming for you next. You either up and run saying goodbye to everything you have or you get help and arm up so you can defend yourself and your property. Kyle knew the person and worked in the city, so he went to help. I would have gone the other route, but they weren't trying to incite violence, they were trying to deter it. Then something happens as Kyle leaves the scene, presumably alone, and then something happens that causes a gunfight. The article i cited says at least 16 gunshots "other" than kyles were heard. Take into account the portland shooting where a group associated with BLM just up and shot a guy simply because " he was a Trumper" and it wouldn't be a stretch for it to be plausible they saw Kyle alone and attacked him first.
@Krypteia, Yes. You. Me. Same side.
@Krypteia, I think you're just trying to be an asshole and don't care about having a meaningful discussion. So kindly piss off and think about why its wrong to want millions dead just because they don't agree with you.
@spongeblade, the thing is, it wasn’t Kyle or the other vigilante’s job. He was not trained, couldn’t even legally use that gun, and didn’t have the mindset to engage in that kind of situation. Because of that, and the choice he made to “play hero” one person was killed (in possible self defense) and another was murdered. Oh, and still haven’t found any evidence for that “he was a trumper” thing you keep baselessly claiming
@spongeblade, again, when you have trump worshippers cheering for Kyle Rittenhouse murdering people you kind of stop caring for those people
@Krypteia, I posted a link and time stamp near the start of the thread....... When a mob of people start burning down businesses and taking a city hostage, any violence caused is on them.
@spongeblade, so a vigilante could go up and just unload a clip into these protestors and it’d be fine?
@spongeblade, so a vigilante could go up and just unload a clip into these protestors and it’d be fine? Also, kind of odd you say “taking a city hostage” when it’s isolated parts of the city and not the entire area
@Krypteia, BLM literally took over blocks of Seattle and made it run by a self proclaimed warlord. The only reason they dont go that far is they know that will incite military action from the feds this time. But it is taking a city hostage. Whos going to go outside when there are hundreds of people burning down buildings at random and people are getting shot?
@Krypteia, and Kyle didn't unload anything. In the video he had pretty precise shots despite being assaulted and forced to the ground.
@spongeblade, yeah, that’s some pretty good fear-mongering. If only it was based in reality. Seriously dude, turn off Breitbart, you’ll feel so much smarter just from that act alone
@Krypteia, I sourced Breitbart for something completely unrelated to BLM. I sourced a video of the the founder of BLM and the nytimes which is pretty left leaning. My opinions are from seeing all the videos of these riots and comments from the thugs involved. Anyways I'm done entertaining you since all you're trying to do is box me in as some "alt right Breitbart Trump" fanboy. Enjoy wanting people dead asshole.
@spongeblade, assaulted? He just killed someone, why wouldn’t people try to stop him? I just think this is insane. So many gun nuts say “I have this gun because if I see a shooter it’s my job to stop them”, and then when a shooter is actually stopped all the gun nuts say “Well, they shouldn’t have tried to stop him”
@spongeblade, I don’t want people dead, just trump worshippers. But I’m glad you associate the first amendment with “being a thug”. Shows how well the alt-right propaganda is working
@spongeblade, but I understand being done. Sorry I wasn’t able to conform to your flawed way of thinking. I assume you have an elementary school somewhere near you. Maybe you can twist their little minds
@spongeblade, I have never agreed and disagreed with someone so much before.
1. Can I get where you got where they’re a terrorist organization? The YouTube video is unavailable.
2. I think they’re a group that is against systemic racism. I think the government is afraid of losing power that they put out false information (such as BLM being terrorists) to spread fear. No one wants communism. We’ve seen it leads to dictatorships.
3. MLK didn’t have any violent protests. But Malcom X and the black panthers did.
4. The protesters are 99% peaceful. Portland is still protesting an NO property damage. It’s only when cops and soon to be cops get involved that bad things happen.
As for fixing the school. YES! So glad you said it. I’ve been preaching that for years. We need to get to the root of the problems.
And yes to better police. They need much better training. That’s coming from a black policeman (neighbor).
@MrTuxPenguin, 1. Being a terrorist organization is my opinion based on the billions in property damage, their calls to violence, the founders saying they're trained marxists, shooting somebody because "they're a Trumper", etc. Ill try and get another link.
2. BLM states theyre against systemic racism while on camera, but their actions where they destroy black communities is proof to me that its all by. When there is video proof of them doing all these violent acts, thats not fear mongering or false information, its fact based reality bad as it is.
3. Yeah I know Malcom X and black panthers did, but I'm dont know enough about them to really diacuss it. I mentioned MLK because I thought he's a perfect example of practice what you preach.
4. I dont think its 99% peaceful with 15-30+ deaths, billions in damage, taking Seattle hostage and establishing a self proclaimed warlord while kicking out all law enforcement, even for medical purposes.
5. Glad we agree on the schools. :)
@Kypteia, so I’m going back and reading your comments. I don’t want to be on the same side as you.
@MrTuxPenguin, ok then. Facts are against you and i hope you realize that as the truth gets out. Have a nice day.
@spongeblade, Dam. That was suppose to be at Kypteia. I thought I replied to him. I swear. I didn’t see before his posts about killing Trump supporters and I’m against that.
@MrTuxPenguin, oh haha.
@spongeblade, I swear haha. It was a callback because I said him and I were on the same side.
@MrTuxPenguin, haha no worries. Kinda threw me off. I was ok, well I thought we were having a good discussion.
Try this link. It's a different channel, but the same video where one of the blm leaders states theyre marxists. https://youtu.be/p7C6tNjiRKY
@MrTuxPenguin, im going to bed now I think anyways. Its been fun talking with you. Hope you stay safe and our country heals. God bless.
@spongeblade, Likewise. Except the bed thing. Hope to speak more.
@Krypteia, I have probably two dozen firearms, ranging from the the compact 380, to stuff, that I previously stated, could punch a hole in an engine block from a couple blocks away. I certainly hope nothing like that ever has to happen, but I'm more than capable of defending my home, FROM my home. I admit, I have a bit of a temper and yet, I dont just go around doing a 1-2 to everyone that pisses me off
@spongeblade, So, I watched the video and had to tell someone. No body knows that BLM is an organization (I’ve seen so many people claim it’s a movement). But the founders from what I’ve researched (are commies) the movement has taken on a life of its own. It’s not about Marxism anymore. It’s about supporting black people and communities. I think this is where all the conflict is coming from. We’re talking about two different things with the same name.
@Krypteia, it depends. Did the person shoot in self defense? Then no, I absolutely would not stop him. Did he instigate and attack someone? Then yes I would.
@Krypteia, you are a fûcking sociopath. It is YOU and people like you that are tearing the country apart.
@Krypteia, you keep calling my evidence "anecdotal", however it is something that actually happened. With multiple witnesses. If anything it would be circumstantial evidence, but considering there were multiple eye witnesses to corroborate the events, even that word would get eliminated.
@spongeblade, thank you. I dont think they actually know what "anecdotal" means
@Krypteia, read the NYT article tracking his movements that night. They make the case for Kyle doing everything in self defense.
Justice is served
Is that what you think you deserve? "I do, and I'm Tired of Pretending It's Not"
When someone holds you in fall guys so you fall but the act of grabbing you causes them to fall shortly after.
*pointing to alt-right Trump worshipper in Portland* Ha!