it be like that
I'm pretty undecided about abortion. I love it because it supports killing children. I hate it because it gives women a choice.
@Abusive Breasts, My support for abortion stems from my recognition of a parent's right to murder their child.
@Abusive Breasts, OMG. Best comment ever
@Abusive Breasts, #bestcomments
@Abusive Breasts, that was so dark, I almost downvoted.
@Abusive Breasts, abortion is such an oppinionated subject. Neither side is inherently right. Both sides have really good points.
@BlazingBowman, and both sides have really bad points, that they yell at anyone who disagrees.
@Abusive Breasts, anti choice pro abortion
@Abusive Breasts, #bestcomments
@Abusive Breasts, I think you flipped your emotions there bud.
(I got the joke, don't worry)
@Abusive Breasts, i love you
@Abusive Breasts, I'm proud to have given the 100th upvote on that
@EatMyAss, abortion and murdering a child are different things
Load up on popcorn, this one is gonna be a shvt storm
@WhatThaFrack, check out the thread from my comment. Oh boy we got ourselves a party! Come on over!
Women, upset you didn't get a say in the new abortion laws? Now you know how men feel that we have no say in you having an abortion with our child. Takes two to make a baby, so there should be two in the decision.
Let the war begin.
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, rape might disagree
@Lastmanonearth, good point. Perhaps I should clarify then: I personally am against abortions, but it is not my place to decide issues like that for others. Even if I was in charge, they would be legal, for others to decide, but I would not allow my girlfriend to get an abortion. Men should also have a choice in this decision, but should not be allowed to leave either.
@Lastmanonearth, less than 1% of abortions are from reported rape and i can guarantee that half of those were probably lying just so they could feel good about it. Also plenty of amazing people that were given life instead of being killed have come out into the world. I.e. Miss tennessee from a couple of years ago great example that everyone should be given a chance at life. "It is a poverty that a child must die in order for you to live your life the way you choose" -mother Teresa... im not trying to preach but come on that other 99.5% just want to run around have sex and party and do whatever they want and not have any consequences for their poor life choices (majority of them)
@tmo0792, unreported rape is more than 10x reported but it's nice you see a safer happier world than truth I guess
@tmo0792, an abortion is dangerous and can cause infertility
@tmo0792, I should clarify, I'm married and never worried about it but helped a female friend after rape
@Lastmanonearth, i know i am against abortion are you not reading my comment lol. Unreported rape. I highly doubt its 10X more simply die to the fact its not reported. I know that it happens. I think that it is horrible. However, when it comes to abortion statistics less that 1% are from reported rape
@Lastmanonearth, i know the feeling but i am a firm believer that is a living being inside the mother not just some non-living creature that they say that it is. It pisses me off.
@Lastmanonearth, so the point of allowing an abortion due to rape is the fact that it was unwanted and it was a traumatic experience that the woman shouldn't have to relive every time they see their child. What if a woman with a 2 year old who looks just like the gets the sh!t beat out of her and is hospitalized for months. Should she be able to kill it because it is a constant reminder of the father and the experience he put her through?
@Lastmanonearth, I will admit that rape is horrible and way to many women are afraid to report it. Throwing a number out for it, like 10x, is where it cause credibility to be lost. If they are not reported, there is no way to know how many times there are.
@Mkb617, I hope none of you segueing for forcing to keep babies ever jerks off killing your living sperm
@Lastmanonearth, that is one of the stupidest arguments out there. yes sperm is living but it is not a life. Comparing sperm to a baby would be like comparing blood to one. They both go into making a baby but neither one is an individual life on its own.
@Mkb617, that argument loses the purity of your point and enters pointless trimester arguments. You don't get to pick what a life is in comparison to living.
@Lastmanonearth, actually almost no professional medical people even argue that a new life starts at the moment of conception anymore. Once the sperm and egg meet it is a new individual life. Sperm on its own can never be a life. But even if someone believes it happens at some point after conception, your point is still invalid because jacking off can never become a life.
@Lastmanonearth, I do like that you did the normal thing people do when faced with arguments on abortion, you didn't comment on any of the actual points I had made initially and tried to make it about something else
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, While I can't find any statistics to back up (or refute) this, I feel like the majority of abortions aren't against the wishes of the guy.
@Apolloss, but the point is that a girl can go and get an abortion, and the man has no choice at all. Men don't get a say either way, and women can abort, or leech child support out of him. Or worse, the woman could be absolutely useless and the father could be a better choice to raise the child, but the courts will always side with the women. So when it comes to kids, women have all the power, and men aren't allowed to choose. So while some may get upset that trump made a decision regarding abortions, women make the decisions otherwise.
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, but why does that mean that men should have a 100% say in the legal side of it?
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, and the courts don't ALWAYS side with women (Coming from someone raised by their father).
@Apolloss, why do women get 100% say on whether they get an abortion or not? It's a sticky issue, no doubt. But it takes two to make a baby, so both men and women need to have a say. The point I'm trying to make is that everybody is upset about a man making this decision, but not thinking about the fact that women make all the decisions otherwise.
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, I'm not saying that it shouldn't have been a man that made the decision, or that men shouldn't have a say, but saying that men get to make the laws regarding it because they don't currently get a say in if a woman has one is ludicrous. That isn't how you solve a problem.
@Mkb617, sperm can make a life in a lab with an egg and I would start on evolution/asexual arguments but that would be wasted on a life starts when an egg is touched by a sperm guy. On the rational/unfeeling side extra population is bad and unsupported children are a drain on society, usually for their entire life
@Apolloss, right, it's not how you solve a problem. But there are women up in arms and so mad about this, but don't see it from the other side. That's the issue I'm pointing out, is that either way someone isn't happy.
@Lastmanonearth, once it is in the lab with the egg it would then be a life but not before. That would be like killing someone because he might be a serial killer later.
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, don't forget women have extremely good biases in court towards them
Especially with child custody
Or you know domestic abuse even though it's even within 5% male and female
Or rape where women get 10x lower sentencing
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, well, generally the decision is made by both parties, except in situations where the father is unavailable(rape/absent father).
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, the reason girls get a 100% say in what to do is because she has to carry it around for 9 months and eject it out of her. If you weren't ready for that result or didnt discussed it with the girl before hand, don't go spewing your juices around/inside of people, it's not that fvcking hard
@Abradolf Lincler, the point they are making is in this case the girl also LET him do it. She didnt have to have sex with him. So she gets 100% choice of whether to keep it or not. Which in turn she get 100% choice on if the man pays child support or not. So the man just has to sit by and not have any say in the matter? Theres no equality there. If she gets 100% of the choice of keeping it or not, then the man should be able to walk away, if he didnt want it, without paying child support.
@Abradolf Lincler, i really don't believe 9 months of carrying a child is equivalent to 18 years of child support. Either abortion laws have to change or child support laws have to. I agree men should always use protection but there are some instances where women can abuse the system. A close family friend was told that the woman had her tubes tied but she ended lying and used him to get child support for 18 years. Something has to change to avoid stuff like that.
@tmo0792, there are plenty of terriable people that have come into this world that should have been aborted. Serial killers, rapist.
Hey if your going to play the card saying all the good people that have come into this world. Then it needed to be pointed out that a lot of bad people have too.
@Seohn, you make no sense lol. Everyone is makes choices. Whether they be good or bad. Those people that are serial killers are that by their own choosing. Even if you compare the number of serial killers to the number of people that are alive in this world compared to the abortions; you do realize it would still be less that .0001%. And that is giving the benefit of the doubt. We are who we are based on our own actions we all have a choice and if those people choose to do wrong then that is not on the mother choosing to keep the child. Part of the problem in this world is we love on a world where parents choose to live how they want and not take responsibility for our actions. Like i said before. We need to learn to keep our dicks in our pants and do things the right way. 99% of the time people get abortions because they cant have self control and want to run around and have sex whenever they feel like it and do not want to pay for their actions. And everyone knows it.
@TheDoctorsTARDIS, unfortunately she has the ultimate choice because it's her body
@Unkle77, but it's also my child... that's why I don't think abortion laws and child support laws are anywhere near fair.
My mom died because I wasn't aborted. My stepmom/aunt always told me I killed her. She is not wrong and she is not right either. My mother had the choice to abort me, doctors even told her I was a risky pregnancy, but she didn't. She took the chances and lived for six months after I was born. My moms choice not to abort killed her and the blame was placed on me. No one can ever win.
@idiotsavant907, out of curiosity are you pro-choice or pro-life?
@Apolloss, I am pro choice
@idiotsavant907, I almost died after my son was born. It wasn't the same situation as your mom, but my life is permanently altered. If it's any consolation, if I knew what would happen ahead of time, I probably would still have him. But I support mom's who have to make a decision too. I don't know their lives. Who cares what those other people say--- your mom loved you enough to die for you. Many women SAY that about their kids but never would. I almost died trying to breastfeed my son because it was the only thing that calmed him down (high needs/sensory disorder). I'd do it all over again I think.
Incoming comments talking about flame wars
Why exactly do posts like this keep adding that they're "white" men like that's something they should be ashamed of or it somehow detracts from whatever point they make?
@Zack Fair, im pretty sure its playing on the stereotype that black men either dont give a ish because they leave anyways or support abortions and that only white men care
@rapey the stick man, you could be right but I didn't believe so. I think it is a comment in the fact that the majority of people in power in business or politics, or most places for that matter, are white men.
@Mkb617, you know thats actually a really good point too. Have an upvote 👍
@Zack Fair, I don't think that people necessarily think it takes away from their argument, and I doubt many think they should be ashamed. The point most are trying to make when they say that is that they might not be seeing it in the same way as others would.
@Zack Fair, look at the makeup of most state govts
Did the last season of Bojack get a little too real for anyone else?
@Rambunc, got pretty dark. If people read this you invest in bojack horseman. It's really good. It's funny and a great depiction of depression.
The title of this kind of pisses me off. Abortion is not a "women's" issue. The murdering of a defenseless life should be an issue for everyone.
@Mkb617, I wouldn't call abortion murder, every legal abortion performed is on a fetus that wouldn't be able to survive at that point outside of the mother. That isn't what I'd call murder.
@Apolloss, so if you see someone laying on the street after an accident and they would not survive without going to the hospital, would you call that murder?
@Apolloss, oops forgot to say part of that... if you see them laying on street after accident and the would not survive without going to the hospital. If you shot them would that be murder?
@Apolloss, and why is it considered double homocide to kill a pregnant woman because they are killing the fetus too but it is not murder if the mother does?
@Mkb617, "it is possible but rare for a double-murder charge to be enforced in cases of homicide in which a pregnant woman is murdered, thereby killing her unborn fetus." A quick search shows that the majority of times that happens it is still considered a singular homicide. The only cases I've found in which a double homicide charge is brought is when the fetus is in the third trimester, which coincidentally is when abortions can no longer be performed.
@Mkb617, also, the incident about someone being in an accident is not viable for multiple reasons, mainly for the fact that a hospital wouldn't be able to keep a fetus alive without the mom anyways.
@Apolloss, I'd call it murder because the cells are taking in nutrients and growing. Two things that living things are known for doing.
@DustMonkey, but then killing any living thing by that definition would be murder. Better not wash your hands, those germs metabolize and grow too you know.
@Apolloss, it is rare because it is usually pleaded down. There are something like 40 states that have fetal protection laws. Because of the debate over them the laws aren't always pushed but they are still there. Also you might want to look in to that third trimester myth.... there are still a couple of states you can get abortion up until the child is born
@Apolloss, i didn't see this comment. Just like the guy who commented on sperm being alive. Yes germs can metabolize and grow but they can never become a person.
@Mkb617, there are 37 states with fetal protection laws and of those, the majority only cover third trimester. And the abortion in 3rd trimesters that you are talking about is ONLY in medical situations in which the mother would likely die from delivering the baby.
@Apolloss, well that is close enough to correct. Now try looking up how often that actually happens. And oh yeah how often those same procedures could have been replaced with C-section. I'll save you the time, if it is that close to the child being born and the mother is that much and that unexpectedly at risk a A c-section could be done. Before you try to argue about the stress of a c-section. Think about the stress of aborting a child that large.
@Mkb617, I am not arguing that an abortion is the only way to solve the issue, but please do some research on Caesarian sections, because they are not a solve-all thing. There are multiple times when C-sections are not only un-safe, but could further injure the mother/fetus.
@Apolloss, oh that is true but believe me not many have done more research than me. But by far in the given situation, that being a woman in the extreme late stages of pregnancy who is at risk of dying because of the child, the odds of the c-section causing worse damage than the abortion is dang near zero
@Mkb617, I'm sorry but that is just not true. Late term abortions are performed in a method known as Dilation and Evacuation (in which they dilate the cervix and remove the uterus) and while this is in no way 100% risk free (Possible things stemming from the procedure include infection, sepsis, hemorrhaging and Damage to the uterus) C -Sections are far more dangerous.
@Apolloss, Of all the things that could be going in at that stage of the pregnancy that could be harming the woman due to the child being there a c-section would almost never make it worse. Yes it is more invasive than the D&E, but in this day an age a c-section is so common there are very few realistic risks involved. I am done with this thread because too many people are posting too much stupid stuff. Not you, although I don't agree at least your arguments are intelligent.
@Apolloss, those germs aren't humans. They won't be humans. A human fetus is a human
I don't like these arguments. They don't get the point of the debate. It's about killing a kid, that's a decision that should be decided by an entire society, not just the 50% who are actually going to be making the choice.
We assembled a panel of women who believe they have the right to discard life as if it were a sandwich they didn't want and asked them if they would take the easy way out of their responsibilities just like the men they would criticize for doing the same thing...
If feminist can talk about "man spreading," with little concern for why we do it, and how it affects our health, then we should be allowed to criticize them for women's issues and whatever the fck else we want.
It would have been a pretty f'd up argument pre-Civil War for someone to say that those who didn't have plantations shouldn't be able to say we don't get to have slaves because they just don't understand the struggle.
If I think it affects other human beings harmfully, I have every right to voice my opinion on the matter.
That's bullsh!t. I can have an opinion about what's right or wrong especially if the stakes are high. Male or not, I get to help make laws along with my conscience.