Also you automatically commit sin by existing.
@Natural Sarcasm , yo! What the fvck?
Who’s side you on?
@seeUpee, the winning side
@Natural Sarcasm , wow man... just wow...
Satan is easy... God is hard...
If you catch my drift ;)
@seeUpee, nah man god is impossible, also a hypocrite. Hail Satan!
Also I think if god exists and is correctly described in the Bible then hell is an impossibility
@Natural Sarcasm , well of course! Do you have a moment to talk about the lord and savior Jesus Christ?
(We both going to hell for this shjt)
@seeUpee, everyone’s going to hell if it exists lol but man you even want to get into heaven? You know how strict the rules are, there are the most boring mother fvckers in all of history there. Hard pass for me, ima party it up in hell where alcohol runs a plenty
@Natural Sarcasm , of course I want to go to haven... hell is hell for a reason bro! You going to be drunk and getting fvcked up the ass ... nothing new for you... but I will add “all eternity” ...what am I saying... bro, enjoy!
@seeUpee, nah hell was a concept invented by the Catholics during the dark ages to squeeze every last dime out of people by saying you can pay your way into heaven. The Bible is becoming more and more obsolete as being a decent person is just common sense and the crazy zealots try bending every word to their narrative
Let me ask you, do you believe god is omniscient?
@Natural Sarcasm , you do know I was raised Catholic right? But I went to the Vatican in 2013 and just got piiiiissed off... it is all a fvcking business man, I couldn’t do shjt with out paying money. Bunch of greedy motherfvckers! I stopped for two seconds to read something and got yelled at! Nhaaa man, Fvck all that shjt! Money is all they care about... why does the pope (even tho he Argentinian) has to be so fvcking wealthy? Carry so much gold around his fingers and neck? Jesus was poor as hell, the pope should be poor as hell too, but no, they are their own darn country and tell us how we should be running this country? No, fvck that man! Fvck it all! I do believe God is Omniscient.
@seeUpee, I mean I figured you were catholic cause most Latinos are. Pretty sure that’s why Spanish/ Portuguese/ and Italian all sound so similar.
Anyway if god is omniscient then that means he knows all, past present and future. Which also means he knows everything you’re going to do before you do it. Which means you’re predestined to go to heaven or hell and free will is a lie.
However if you believe that god is all forgiving then that means your path was set for a reason, mistakes and all. And hell is a concept of men not god as god already knew everything so what would be the purpose of hell?
@Natural Sarcasm , I think I am more Baptist now myself... I highly believe that men can’t be single... we have needs and they need to be married... I also believe it is on our own free will what happens with us... you are pretty much saying that God knows the future so he knows that we are doomed or not... I don’t believe that... I wasn’t the same piece of shjt I was 10 years ago and I know I will not be the same 10 years from now. People change, I try to do good but we all know temptation is right there! Weakness and addiction a step away. Just have to take in Jesus... as our lord and savior, man. You have to believe!
@seeUpee, so you don’t believe god is omniscient
@Natural Sarcasm , like future all knowing? Guess not
@seeUpee, cool so we’ve established that god has limitations yes?
@Natural Sarcasm ,mainly bc we are humans, we are unpredictable... at the same time I believe he is not restricted by time as he is timeless... whatcha trying to get at?
@seeUpee, that free will is a construct meant to help us cope with inevitable doom. Truth is if there is a god there would be no purpose for heaven or hell. It’d all be a lie. A good lie though meant to direct us to morally just causes. Hell there was a point in history where we had to teach people that murder was wrong lol. Pretty easy to see why heaven and hell were invented.
@seeUpee, I’m three whiskeys in to help translate to Sunday you lol
@Natural Sarcasm , three shots? ... see... whisky makes you think! You should switch to vodka like me! You ever watch Louis CK if there was no murder law? I think that probably answer it all... I agree and disagree with you. Just answer me this... what do you believe in? you believe there is a God?
@seeUpee, I like the concept of god and try to rationalize it to the best of my ability but ultimately no I believe god is a concept we came up with to rationalize our own concept of death. We are after all the only creatures on earth that try to draw meaning from death and have the ego to think we are so special that there is no way we don’t have an afterlife
@Natural Sarcasm , so you like the concept? That is it? Like you don’t believe?... I can dig the meaning from death... afterlife... now, if you don’t mind what made you think this way? What even in your life made you go... Hold up, this is bullshjt? Someone dying too soon from cancer?
@seeUpee, I don’t believe truthfully, it just seems like a scapegoat. Reality sucks but the only way to fix it is to acknowledge what’s wrong with it. I don’t believe some god like figure hovers over us and determines who is worthy. I think if we want to get shjt done we best do it ourselves
You ever watch the futurama episode where bender is god? “When you do things right, people won’t be sure you’ve done anything at all”
@Natural Sarcasm , that episode is awesome! Poor Bender... practically you said you don’t believe in God like figure... but sounds like you still believe in a God
@seeUpee, I want to but ultimately the more I think about it the less I believe
@Natural Sarcasm , and why is that? Some negative thing going on in your life?
@Natural Sarcasm , as a goy or gentil one can still get into heaven. Even atheists lol
@Natural Sarcasm , my problem with the concept of hell as presented by Catholicism is how pointlessly sadistic it is. The whole point of punishing someone for misbehaving is to attempt to correct their behaviour so they don’t do it again.
Hell is eternal, which means that it’s far too late to learn anything and you’ll never have the opportunity to live again to commit more offences, which means the suffering of the damned souls in hell is without goal, it’s just suffering for the sake of suffering.
@Natural Sarcasm , oh man you two make me want to tear apart this convo for 4 hours; but thats not why I have this app lol
@Natural Sarcasm , Hell is an impossibility!? I'm right here man, that's my home you're talking about
Do I get elite status? Keys to executive sinners wash room?
@megamanx181x, you gotta break the record, and I yea I will make sure you have some awards and special services
Just to throw it out there, that's what repentance is for
(Crunks shoulder angel) no,no, he's got a point
“Don’t hate the player...”
The only reason that anyone has to think that God is the good one and Satan is the evil one is because God says so.
If God is truly omnipotent and created the universe knowing and having a plan for everything that would ever happen, it would mean that God is the source of every evil on earth, every bit of suffering, and the only reason that Satan would exist to tempt people into salvation is because God wanted those people to be damned.
The Biblical God Yahweh is the single most evil being conceivable.
@I Are Lebo, But then you introduce the concept of free will. God will not interfere with anyone's power to choose, and *that* is where much of the evil in this world comes into fruition.
@TheKen42, doesn’t follow. Infectious disease, prenatal brain disorders, flesh eating bacteria, dangerous predators, insidious parasites, lethal environments, dangerous viruses, toxic parthenogens, permanent developmental disabilities, the list of evils in this world that have absolutely nothing to do with free will is extremely long.
God is responsible for all of it.
In addition, every person that succumbs to the temptation of Satan is also the fault of God, because he allows Satan to sway people, therefore undermining their free will.
The biblical God is a hypocrite and a liar who regularly subverts the free will of humans. He kills Onan for refusing to impregnate Oman’s brother’s widow. He completely disregards Job’s free will by purposefully ruining Job’s life and taking away everything he had (including his family). He took away the Pharaoh’s free will by hardening his heart against the pleas of Moses (the story even specifies that Pharaoh was willing to let them go but God
wasn’t finished with his plagues yet).
No, the excuse that God is omnipotent amd omniscient but isn’t evil because ‘free will’ is absolutely nonsense and holds no water.
That would be like a father allowing one son to rape and murder another without intervening because they want to respect their kid’s choices. You can’t have it both ways. If God knows everything that will happen in any given individual’s lives, prior to their birth, and that life includes needless suffering that twists them into an angry person who does bad things and then after that person dies condemns their soul to eternal torment for not rising above challenges that God knew, in advance, would be insurmountable for that individual, then not only did God set them up to fail and suffer endlessly, but that He willfully chose that fate for them with no mercy or compassion.
Such a deity would be the very definition of Evil. Sadistic, unmerciful, discompassionate, and psychopathic.
The God of the Bible is a narcissistic psychopath that endlessly tortures innocent people for not praising Him enough.
There’s no perspective other than willful ignorance that can paint that figure as benevolent.
@I Are Lebo, If you think about our existence starting at birth and ending at death, then yeah, we got the short end of the stick for reals. However, our existence began before our life on earth, and will continue after into infinity. Our time here on earth is meant to be a rite of passage, of sorts. With that in mind, a rite of passage without challenges (disease, natural disasters, etc...) is no rite at all, and our moral lufe would be for naught. Similarly, God allows Satan to tempt us and lead us astray because there must be an opposition to all things, otherwise our free will is not in use, and our rite of passage is devoid of spiritual challenges.
In summary, God allows bad things to happen so that we may hardships to learn and grow from.
The three verse blip about Onan is a bit different; he *does* lay with her, but then pulls out, which is what upset God. Otherwise, this is not nearly enough information for us to make any kind of judgment.
God did not ruin Job's life, but allowed Satan to put Job trough those trials (Reference to the afore mentioned 'allowing'). Not to mention that God rewarded Job for remaining faithful. A doubling of his estate, if I recall the wording correctly. Actual, this little topic kinda mirrors the whole book of Job, after a bit of review.
The hardening of Pharoah's heart is more due to translation error (it was been translated and re-translated by mere men, afterall), and it really is Pharoah hardening his own heart.