Hey can we just like have human decency please
@Tazbrum, only if you can figure out how to get the entire human race to collectively un-bite an apple
Hahahahaha cause he faked a hate crime!
@Medic135, he didn't really fake it. That was very clearly a noose, and yeah it turned out not to be a hate crime but that doesn't mean it didn't look like one at first. Why would he have known it would be there before he got there? That's what the investigation was for.
@Commander Peanuts, that noose, which was there to pull the rope down for the garage door (we have them at work here too), has been there for years. And ol' bubba never even saw it, someone else did and he took it and ran. The guy has definitely been loving the attention too, especially for a nascar driver who im told is not very good
@Medic135, I've used rope for my garage too. using a noose knot is stupid for a garage door first of all, but yes, let's ignore that. So someone on his team comes up to him and says "hey man, there's a noose in your garage." What do you expect his reaction to be? "Oh well can we scour the internet to see if it's already been there?" I'm not saying it wasn't a mistake, but it seems like a pretty normal reaction if you ask me. Maybe he's been "loving the attention" because now it's his chance to be the representation he is on a larger scale. He's not lying, he's not denying the results of the investigation, he's literally just talking about the issue to people who are asking him about it.
@Commander Peanuts, Or he can go look, at the tiny ass "noose" tied in the door rope. Which can only even hang when the door is open, and even then not much. Its not as though a genuine noose waz strung from the ceiling for all to see as a giant racist middle finger. He saw an opportunity for attention, he jumped it
@Medic135, so you've never seen something that immediately pissed you off or made you feel some way without reading into the situation? Tell me, what's more believable, he sees something that clearly resembles a noose, which, days after nascar bans the Confederate flag, could very easily be interpreted as a hate symbol, whether it could actually functionally be used to hang someone or not, or, as you seem to think he saw it, recognized it as an ineffective but clearly functional pull rope with no other possible connotations, thought "hmm, I could spin this as a PR stunt" and then decided to blow it up for the press? Come on. He's not some scheming mastermind. He's a racecar driver.
@Commander Peanuts, no, he never bothered to see it. But hey you seem to think hes justified so its whatever, im gonna go start a riot because i heard theres a swastika in my workplace. Granted its down in the mess of pipes in the furnace room, but im gonna assume its there about me and get famous off it now because its clearly a dig at my religious heritage
@Medic135, sure, dude. That's the same thing.
@Commander Peanuts, yes. It very literally is.
@Medic135, did you hear about that one racist thing that happened at that place? No need to see if it’s true let’s just get mad. Where are the cameras?
@Natural Sarcasm , this boi gets it 👏
@Commander Peanuts, a loop does not a noose make.
@CocoasBro, you're right. And have you seen the picture of the rope? That's no hitch knot.
edit: please see my later reply to someone else about how it's literally a noose knot
@Medic135, to be fair he didn’t see it, but was told by multiple people including a nascar higher up that a noose was found in his garage, he also did not report the noose to the fbi, nascar did after they found no other garages had a pull rope like that, in light of recent events I feel that deems an investigation
@Commander Peanuts, if he was totally innocent of doing this for attention then why did he go on tv after the FBI declared it not a noose, still saying it's a noose. Then why did he go on again after that to say anyone who doubted him was apart of the race problem? I can't pity this guy.
@Dephenistrator, "Whether tied in 2019 or whatever, it was a noose. So, it wasn't directed at me but somebody tied a noose. That's what I'm saying." -Bubba. If you look at the pictures of the rope, that's definitely a noose. Whatever the intentions were, there's no denying that.
As for what he said about people doubting him, that was said before the FBI results, but also I believe the meaning is that if you look at that initial situation, and you don't think it's possible something like that could happen, you're blind to the reality of racism in America. Sure, it ended up not being a hate crime. And that's a relief to everyone. But that fact that it's so believable that it could have been means there are still some issues worth thinking about.
@Commander Peanuts, no, he said it after the fbi investigation. It doesn't look like a noose, and hate towards blacks in this country is extremely hard to find. Especially hard to find in this country. I think your blind to the situation that this guy did it for attention and he got alot of it. Nascar had everyone in the race parade out with him in solidarity, if that's racism then the US is really bad at it. Just like we are so bad at racism that we all condem the cop who killed George floyd. I'm sorry but race isn't an issue because it's our biggest issue. It's an issue because it's an election year and that's the only reason.
@Dephenistrator, it's literally tied in a noose knot. And if you're seriously one of those people that thinks that racism isn't an issue because there are people standing against it then I'm not going to waste my time here. It's really not hard to find at all. But just because you think you haven't seen it it can't be there right? "I'm not racist, so there's no way this country is racist." Come on.
@Commander Peanuts, the US stands against racism, and you are blind with hate if you can't see that. You are gonna have to prove to me this country is racist because that's laughable to anyone with a brain. Laughable.
Also, by your logic, shoes are tied in nooses to. That's a weak claim, let it go and stop hiping there's a shred of racism left for you to fight. You need a time machine for that.
@Commander Peanuts, saying there's endless systematic hate when there's not is just as bad as being racist, you need to ashamed of yourself
@Commander Peanuts, hate spreading people like yourself think you stand out on the moral high ground calling out racism, but your just stirring up racial tensions where there is none anymore. You want peace between everyone as human beings, you do not do a jussie smollett, or claim everything is racist. If someone rains down hate because they think their skin color is superior then condem that particular person. America already defeated systematic racism, you missed it. It's over.
@Dephenistrator, examples of systemic racism: job application where the only difference is a white name vs a black name. Black people are chosen way less https://www.nber.org/papers/w9873 black students are 3 times as likely to be suspended for the same infractionshttps://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ocr/docs/crdc-discipline-snapshot.pdf black children are 18 times more likely to be sentanced as adults than white children http://www.apa.org/pubs/journals/releases/psp-a0035663.pdf black people on average have 20% longer jail times for the same crime https://www.ussc.gov/research/research-reports/demographic-differences-sentencing the entire practice of redlining. Please let me know if you want more. Theres entire classes on this subject
@Dephenistrator, also have you seen pictures of the thing? Its a noose literally everyone that has seen it (nascar, the worker who reported it, the fbi, etc) have all described it as a noose
@Commander Peanuts, an actual noose is 13 loops going around, not the 4 or 5 that one had. And they are also hung from a strong piece of structure, not a garage door. Not to mention there is video proof of it being there from last year, as well as other non-nascar garages using the same thing.
@CocoasBro, coming from the 23 year old who like to call people racist lol.
@Runnin with scissors, someone who admitted to being racist.
@CocoasBro, I never admitted I was a racist (I do think we all have the capacity to be racist though) in fact I actually called you racist towards the end lol. You really hate reading huh? Go back and watch more youtube to comfort you.
@Commander Peanuts, not all circular loops are nooses.
@big freedom, yes, and once again, if you look at the picture of the knot, that's not a granny knot, it's not a two-half-hitch, it's not a bowline, it's not a taught line, it's not a Honda knot, it's not a kreh loop, it's not a Davy knot, it's not a surgeon's loop, it's not a perfection loop, and so on. I'm not denying that the intention wasn't a hate crime. It wasn't. IT WAS NOT A HATE CRIME. But y'know what it was? A noose knot. As in, the specific knot used for nooses. And yes, that knot is also used for fishing. And that's probably why it was there. Because someone knew it from fishing and didn't know any better knots to use. But trust me when I say, I am VERY confident that it was a noose knot.
@colt1245, i guess i want more since you didn't provide anything that proves your point I've heard these studies as they have come up repeatedly lately with all the carnage going on. The same studies have been done for southern white names and they are also looked over in the same numbers, as well as for both your example and mine minority employers had identical tendencies ir showed favoritism. Its easy to manipulate data especially when people make up so much garbage to be mad about that they make classes that exist because they were not supressed about how suppressed they are. Maybe affirm action suppresses minorities by limiting how many whites can get those courses before them regardless of test scores? I've seen whites fired for saying the non racist phrases like "all lives matter". I've seen countless black on white hate crimes never get labeled as a hate crime like the old lady who was thrown down into a fire hydrant or the store owner beaten with a large wooden plank for-
@colt1245, telling a rioter to stop smashing her windows. I've seen minorities say all whites are the devil and somehow believe they themselves are not filled with racist hate. I won't deny there are hateful people out there of all origins. but to say this country is seething with racism is warped from reality to put it nicely. That's the kind of blanket accusation is what is garbage here. If someone does something hateful, then scorn them for it. If your redefining what racist means to justify hating all whites then you and your hate are the racism in the room.
And yes I've seen a picture of the garage pull rope in the secure locked nascar and heavily secure nascar garage that 15 separate FBI members decided was not a noose. It doesn't look like noose. It would be a hell of a story to say a racist got in there a last year and somehow predicted he would eventually get that garage next to threaten him prematurely. That's difficult to believe on nearly all levels.
@Not him again, I never said it was a noose made with the intention to hang someone. I never said it wasn't there before. In fact, I'm in total agreement that it was put there to close a garage door. All I was saying was that it IS tied in the noose knot, which does not require 13 loops, in fact it only needs 1 but 4 to 6 are recommended. And that recommendation is for fishing, where it's also commonly used. I've used it a lot for that. That's probably what the person who tied it used it for. But that doesn't change the fact that it's literally a noose, and therefore it's not surprising someone interpreted it as one.
@Commander Peanuts, i don't trust you. Also, you may not know that a bunch of whites were lynched for supporting blacks as well. Not entirely related but people often forget how many whites have died or fought for minorities over time.
@Dephenistrator, well then I encourage you to look it up yourself. Try to find another knot that fits the bill. And that other piece of information is completely irrelevant.
@Commander Peanuts, i have seen this garage door handle, i guess your assuming if i did i would have no choice but to agree with you but the outcome is that it looks like it's a handle and doesn't imply lynching without using alot of imagination, especially alot to go and report it
@Dephenistrator, no I'm not assuming anything about any conclusions you may come to. And don't you think that if I shouldn't assume the conclusions you come to, you shouldn't assume the conclusions other people, with other experiences and other perspectives would come to either? You and I can look at a noose knot hanging from a door and think "oh, that's to pull it shut." Someone who watches a lot of cowboy movies or plays a particular word guessing game a lot would look at it and think "ha, that rope looks like a little noose." So what then is stopping someone from seeing it as a hate symbol? Granted, that would be an incorrect assumption, but as we've established, we can't know what other people would assume.
@Commander Peanuts, i do agree jussie smollet might think it's a noose for a hate crime or someone of similar caliber that's just looking for the racism they can't find.
I think if there's fair debate on a topic your right. If we are debating wether or not the universe is on a holographic field then that's up for debate. If someone gases millions of jews then i expect them to conclude them as vile. So there are different ways that could go. I've seen the rope, 15 fbi agents have seen the rope, it's been there for over a year. Every bit of this reeks of bullshít. I don't think people still fighting those saying it's a hate crime are doing so with any good intent. They are would have to either just be blindly angry to miss reason or have ulterior motives to perpetuate debate to keep people upset. The evidence stands that bubba and his crew never should have put our country through this at a sensitive time and i frown on them for that. The voices of the angry and accusive are drowning
@Commander Peanuts, Out reason and coming together. This is just another devisive story that will spur on more violence when it clearly since the very beginning never needed to happen.
I am glad he finally, since we started this dialogue, came out and apologized for it and wanted to move. We needed that. We need everyone to chill out before more lives are lost or neighborhoods literally burned down in the 21st century.
@Dephenistrator, do you have a link to the study about southern names? Also what is a southern name? I live in the south everyone just has basic white names
@colt1245, you've never heard names like Cletus?
No, i didn't save it because i didn't think anyone would seriously take that crap to heart. You kinda have to hope you can dig racism out of bias statistical experiments to think that proves anything. Especially with affirmative action, it doesn't even make sense because the sole institutional racism is against whites. It's painful that these truths exist and people ignore them. If you want to argue individual cases of racism that's one thing, but to blanket the US, one of the first countries to end slavery, as racist through and through is absurd. I mean, did you miss the last president? That's the highest office of power btw.
@Dephenistrator, good point for cletus. The us was not one of the first countries though. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_abolition_of_slavery_and_serfdom only Africa and asia are worse
@colt1245, first, those are continents full of countries, not countries.
Second, you are correct that the US is not the first, but it is no where near the staple as the same list has shown the entire planet engulfed in slavery including some still today in africa and middle east. China too if you count the muslim internment camps but that's technically debatable.
I recall that we were the first. I do not at all guve ground on this as a racist country as we abolished slavery very quickly as a country, whites fought and died in the tens of thousands against it. It's been legally fought at every turn since, it's been socially fought at every turn and to think this country is deeply racist is just as flawed as i previously stated. Answer me this, how does saying everything is racist bring us closer to everyones kids playing together? If someone condemned blacks or never campaigned for laws to take voting away from people based on skin color or said they are less than human then we can-
@colt1245, - Talk. For example, as I'm getting tired and I'm not sure I'm still making my best arguments, george floyds death kicked off these protests about institutional racism. But his death displayed anything but that. I have not heard any evidence that the cop himself was racist but it's irrelevant to this example so let's presume he is, he unjustly kills floyd. He is promptly fired with an investigation. All four officers get let go. Then all four get charged including for murder then second degree murder. Is that not as much justice as we can get in this aftermath? How is that a failure of the institutions? Was he supposed to be guillotined by a mob to feel justice here?
@Dephenistrator, its more to recognize things like this https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_Sampson where a black man was arrested over 300 times for trespassing while he was at his workplace. Or any of the other events. Its trying to bring a light on them so people will recognize it. Also put an end to police unions to allow cops to actually be tried and fired when they do messed up stuff like this
@colt1245, i agree and disagree. I can easily agree with those ideas you just stated because that is police reform and peaceful protest. I support all that, but when i see cities literally burn, defund or with Minneapolis get rid of their police force, and see people smash any statue they can (not even related to race by their already shakey excuses) when i see people hurting, and killing eachother out there, , dozens of cops have been murdered, businesses and neighbors might as well have been fire bombed, just.... these riots are filled with hate and evil that needs to stop. Some are hateful for race reasons and some are just antifa being themselves and none are doing any good. Imagine the difference in race relations over the next decade after this violence, then imagine it again if it was just protesters. No cops getting shot or stabbed in the neck, no elderly getting slammed into a fire hydrant or macies employee beaten in a store. It could have been so much more. Now it's chaos
@colt1245, also, i think unions had an amazing purpose back in the day but everything they fought for is federal law, now i just see paychecks siphoned like a tax to do no good. There purpose is virtually lost and i frequently complained they protected our worst employees at my first job and this is the same kind of stuff in police. Unions either need a very deep overhaul or just be busted. Sorry, that was off topic.
@Commander Peanuts, I didn't say it REQUIRED 13 loops, but thats typically how they were made for hanging people, not fishing. The fact is, he's not a winning driver, and he and his crew used this as a publicity stunt.
@Not him again, what I was saying is that it doesn't matter how many loops there are to be recognized as a noose. You don't see a burning cross in someone's yard and think "hm, that cross is only 3 feet tall. You couldn't crucify someone on that, so it must not be a hate symbol." It doesn't matter how many loops there are or what it's secured to. It's far from a "fact" that this was a publicity stunt. Maybe, before the investigation, given the circumstances, he legitimately thought it was put there to send a message. Why is that harder to believe than that he wanted to become famous from a fake hate crime? Don't you think if that was the case maybe he could've tied up a noose himself? Would've been a lot harder to find evidence against his claim then.
@Medic135, why should he go see it? Wouldn’t you just trust your coworker if they told you someone placed a symbol of hate where you work?
@IndianShark, hi friend, please see my previous conversation as im confident it has all the same questions and answers as you and i would end up with
@Commander Peanuts, if a crime was committed against you, wouldn't you want to see it with your own eyes? Instead of just blowing it way out of proportion to get attention? He's not a winning driver, just like Colin Kaepernick wasn't a winning QB, just like Jussie Smollett was a terrible actor. They use being black as an excuse to make noise in the media for their lack of talent. Have you seen billionaires like Jay-Z and Beyonce, or Oprah claiming hate crimes against themselves? Or any other black actor or rapper? They are all for the movement, which I don't blame them for.
You are part of the problem that thinks everything is racist or offensive. I have gay friends, black friends, etc. I don't look down on them for being different from me
@Not him again, oh boy. Ok let's clear this up right away. I am NOT part of that cancel-culture, ultra offended, everything is racist mentality. I never once on here Expressed that I was. Don't strawman me into being something I'm not.
Now, what I AM saying, is that you can't look at a situation at the outcome, and completely ignore or dismiss what was leading up to it. It is a FACT that days before this incident happened, nascar banned the Confederate flag. It is a FACT that that rope was not put there as any kind of a hate symbol. But do you honestly expect people not to be reactionary to anything? He's a human being. Humans are emotional, and humans make mistakes.
What I have been advocating for this entire time is simply perspective. We learn in history class about lynchings. It's reasonable to assume Bubba learned about them too. So what gives you any degree of certainty that your conspiracy is true and that him making a human reaction that led to a human mistake isn't?
@Commander Peanuts, but the FACT is that once it was proven to neither be a hate crime, nor done on purpose, he should have dropped it. And your "perspective" is highly diluted. I think you need to get out into the real world and see what it's actually like.
Hell I let my black neighbor, who is married to a white woman borrow my tools all the time. Guy is a good dude.
I have nothing against the color your skin, theres plenty of white people that deserve the needle just the same.
But to blow out of proportion something that meant nothing is using the media for personal gain. I don't give a shjt if you're blue or purple. He's using it for publicity
@Not him again, you have no idea how much real world experience I have. I'm glad you have a black friend. Have you asked him what he thinks? Have you asked him how he would feel if it were him who was told his garage had a noose in it? Because that might be a conversation worth having. Borrowing tools is great. But it doesn't prove anything about knowing how other people act and feel.
@Commander Peanuts, I never said he was my friend (although I do have black friends), but I trust him enough to borrow my tools. I take it from your personality you haven't worked on much in your life. You should stop complaining and learn how to work on things and learn how much tools actually cost.. People like you are causing more problems than you are helping solve them.
If you had real world experience, you wouldn't be on here spouting off about something you know nothing about, much less something you didn't even experience, just like Bubba didn't
@Not him again, ok man, keep assuming things about me. Keep saying "people like me" are the issue. But maybe go have that conversation with one or more of your black friends and feel free to let me know how it goes. Because at least I have that real world experience.