Once again, the issue isnt that minimum wage is low, its that the cost of living/education is too damn high
@speedway guy, So in comparison to the cost of everything else you could say that minimum wage is.... low
@K1l, that way of thinking is how inflation happens
@speedway guy, inflation happens when everyones wages are artificially raised. But when you only raise the bare minimum to an amount that still isn’t even that high, it won’t really affect much, aside from the individuals who would make more money.
People who typically make less money would then have more money to spend on luxury items/items in general, which would benefit the economy. Prices would overall remain the same because the vast majority of people would still be making the same.
@K1l, thats how it should work, but thanks to late stage capitalism and corporate greed the big companys being made to implement those wages end up raising their prices and laying off employees to keep profits from going down
@K1l, yeah, NYC, Seattle, and several CA cities are dealing with massive job losses in the lower working class because of their wage increases. Small businesses can’t compete and close up shop and larger corporations charge headlong into automation or lay off absolutely everyone they can without ceasing to function. In the end it causes a massive economic headache for the lower classes and does basically nothing to help. Especially in states where minimum wage is the federal or less than $12/hr already
IMO, what we should do is set the minimum wage to $8.65/hr (roughly the value when it was raised to $7.25 when accounting for inflation) and then index it to inflation from that point on a yearly basis. This way we don’t have to have this conversation every few years and minimum wage workers aren’t being completely left behind due to inflation devaluing their wage
@speedway guy, also that minimum wage doesn’t adjust to inflation which happens yearly regardless. I would prefer to set it to automatically increase depending on yearly inflation, but eh
Customer: “I asked to hold the mayo.”
Employee: “I did.”
i work my butt off in a cubicle office job i went to get a bachelors for and i make $17 an hour. no way some highschool degree videogame neckbeard kid is gonna get $15 for making burgers looking like that
@Z0IDBERG, you could always ask for more money
@Z0IDBERG, I work in a warehouse for $20/he, I refuse to let some burger flipper get paid near me. My pay won't rise due to the $15 either, so I will be making slightly above minimum wage for the work I do. Also, I worked at McDonalds, it's not a $15/hr job
@Z0IDBERG, I work for an oil company and started out at 18/hr when min wage was 5.15. Now I work for a oil field fishing company answering phones and making job sheets on a 3.5k/2week salary. High school diploma video game neckbeard proud
@Z0IDBERG, what the hell did you go to college for to work in a cubicle for $17/hr? I was doing that, making that at 18 in a call center before I got into construction and said fvck college
@Z0IDBERG, yeah man, first job out college for me is at a medical device company making 33/hr I think they're screwing you
@Atomicking74, ssshh i almost convinced myself that college was a good idea
@Z0IDBERG, well what did you go to college for, maybe it's just your current job. I got an engineering degree
@Z0IDBERG, yeah man, they're screwing you, find a new job
@Z0IDBERG, average starting salary of a marketing major is 50k / 25 hr
@Z0IDBERG, my yearly salary is pretty good, but at my current rank an hour of my time is worth less than $15. I'm a Firefighter/Paramedic. No fast food drop out is getting more than me and they don't deserve to and I'm not sorry
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, making 34/hr, 80 hrs a week in the refineries. F**k college
@An Everyday Penguin, that 80 hours a week is what most people would be trying to avoid. Glad you are happy! Absolutely you can make money without college.
@Majesticmoose00, If I'm working less than 50 hrs a week I'm moving to the next refinery. Making the money while I'm young, before my body breaks down. Haha
@An Everyday Penguin, a solid plan.
@Z0IDBERG, everytime you post a comment like this some millionaires are laughing there ass off that they managed to successfully turn the middle and lower classes against each other
@An Everyday Penguin, Which plant are you at? I'm at SASOL working for Turner.
@Ze Grammar Nazi, ExxonMobil Polyethylene in Beaumont. Was out at CITCO a few years back. Out here with APACHE.
@ReverseGiraffe, honestly! Let's degrade those with less opportunity than us, but it's totally ok that McDonald's CEO made over a ten million dollars last year.
@Bluemama, you head a multibillion dollar company that employs tens or hundreds of thousands of employees across the world and take home a honest low 6 figure salary? Me too! We need more people in the world like us that run world-wide companies for less of a salary than a small town lawyer makes!
@Bluemama, we should totally pay high school dropouts and people that work in a "starter job" their entire lives, putting pre-packaged frozen fries in a basket $15/hr. You know what? Fvck it, let's give them $20 and we'll make those millionaires pay for it! Yeah, take away all incentive and reward to running a company that employs a quarter of a million people And since minimum wage is higher, let's start raising the cost of living more since poor people have more money and really fvck the middle class!
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, I don't remember saying that he should make a six figure salary. I'm saying that ten million and fifteen thousand is a large gap and if we look at Costco who pays their employees a living wage we will see that it's possible to make money while not squashing the employees below you, some things are just greed. I don't really believe in the $15 minimum wage thing, because I think it will just raise prices, I do believe in more readily raises for good service and loyalty, then the sandwich think might not have happened. My comment was made with disgust at people degrading others for daring to want a living wage, because they make so much money and the lower class needs to make so much less than them instead of looking up and thinking that money should be more evenly distributed.
@Bluemama, unless you're a manager, I don't believe McDonald's employment is worth a living wage. A living wage insinuates you can LIVE off that salary and flipping frozen burgers does not constitute as a job you should be able to own or rent a home on your own. It's a free market, no one is forcing them to work their and if they had a skill that's more beneficial to society, they wouldn't work for minimum wage. There literally thousands of unfilled employment positions for skill labor right now
@Bluemama, the people that are crying the most over the $15 dollars are the ones that started working there in high school, never tried to better themselves even within the company to move up the ranks, work 40 hrs a week or less, don't ask for more work or more training to take on more responsibility and eventually earn more. They just do the same job day in and day out and ask for more and Cry that being a dishwasher doesn't let them afford being a homeowner
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, this is where we may disagree, I think anyone that does a job well should be treated and paid well, because every job is important. Some jobs are obviously more important and yes they should make more, but we still need the people doing the lesser jobs. Also, not all the time does someone have the time or means to better themselves.
@Bluemama, why would they not have time to better themselves?
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, I don't know everyone's life, so I can only give the example's I know, my mom didn't have time to study, she had two jobs and couldn't afford to quit one, though she worked with the mentally disabled, not McDonald's. Had an Aunt that worked for McDonald's for like seventeen years and she finally passed her GED and now works at the DMV, she just doesn't understand math.
@Bluemama, ok so I don't mean this to sound mean or malicious at all. I'm sure you mom and aunt are awesome people. My issue is this though if you work solely at McDonald's or some other minimum wage job and can't afford a house or food, there are government assistance programs for that. No if while in that position you decide to have kids, that's stupid. They don't deserve that. Not in a moral way but financial way. I want a Mercedes to drive on the weekends, can I afford it? No, so I don't have one. If you can't afford a family. Don't have one. Take management training classes through your job (almost every corporate job offers it) and become a shift manager, assist manager then general manager. Then have a family. In the case of your aunt, if she doesn't understand math, I don't see societies role in giving her more money despite not understanding highschool level math. If it's due to a disability,again, there are assistance programs for that.
@Bluemama, I am not saying I disagree that there is extreme greed in the world. If you have enough money that your great great great grand kids never have to work, good for you, but stop being greedy. They problem isn't necessarily the money, but the power (over world leaders and governments) that come with power and yes we should fight it. But this leftist idea that everyone should be able to live off their salary no matter what they do is flawed. You're telling new generations that do don't have to do SHJT, drop out of school and work at Burger King your whole life and you'll be able to still own an apartment and a car.
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, my mom had children in marriage and then decided it was better to struggle than live in an abusive relationship. The don't have children argument is completely shallow because you do not know the circumstances in which someone had a child. My aunt is not mentally disabled, she just isn't good with numbers and it's not if life didn't get in the way of her studying, even still she did a job well for years and she should be able to afford the necessities for that.
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, yes, I think they should be able to afford an apartment and a car, not a new one, not a nice one, but yes.
The real problem here is that minimum wage hasn’t been rising at a stable rate over the years, now they’re trying to play catch-up, and a big jump that fast is going to screw those same low wage workers that want the raise out of the job (more automation like apps/touch screens to order)
You got extra cheese tho
Gtf Outta here , simple jobs for simple minds , pick up a trade or something that not just anyone can do and you’ll be worth more money to a company
@Randy Lorde Marsh , yeah, but given the people with 85IQ is 15% of are population, we have to atleast have give jobs that pay for the cheapest housing and cheapest food. What's the point of jobs if it doesn't keep you alive
@RomeoStealYoGurl, plus, someone has to do it, given you won't do the simple jobs.
@RomeoStealYoGurl, ok YOU create a job for them that pays 15.00/hr and if it works for a year then it’ll be a miracle. Don’t pretend it’s ok for you to force others to overpay the worst of society
@Gothem, just because you don't value McDonald workers, Walmart shelf stockers, or any low skill job doesn't mean we don't fully enjoy and take advantage. You use the amenitys that low wage people provide you yet you don't believe they should earn a bare minimum living wage that allows them to continue providing you that service. Who wins from this.
@RomeoStealYoGurl, you make assumptions and transpositions but ignoring that, McDonald’s and Wal Mary beginning wages are for high school kids, not meant for 40 year olds that have had 20 years to better themselves. If you’re making min wage at 30 you need to have an intervention
The challenge stands- if you think paying lazy or dim whitted ppl 15/hr is a great business decision then prove it with your own business first
@Gothem, ideally it should be for younger people starting out, but we can't have everyone going for high skilled jobs. Robots haven't taken over yet, and giving that most min wage jobs are taken by older people atm, it's ludicrous to drop support of so many people that allow me to get the convenience I want. Younger people are sh1t workers. Also the dim witted/lazy thing is just straight wrong, I've met boatload extremely intelligent, hard working people in min wage jobs who don't really care about money. And make do with good social life and Hobby's. You know, humbleness. Who don't seek happiness with flashy jobs.
Like Jesus it's like you don't go out much, and the look down attitude is disgusting to be honest, your the only one here who needs the intervention friend. We're all humans trying to make by life. Who cares if its not maximum profits for company's when most of there customers can't even afford rent.
What over multi-billion dollar corporation gets away with paying it's workers barely livable wages just because the work is viewed as "low class"? Too many people here are looking at other people's jobs and have the never to tell them what they do and do not deserve. Doesn't everyone eat?
@Galavant , what do you think a 40year old that flips frozen burgers and assembles chicken sandwiches, while working next to a high student that hasn't even graduated yet, deserve to make? You can just pay people more money so they can "afford their own apartment" because you think it's fair. The world isn't fvck fair, you don't get a participation trophy as an adult. If you don't desire to better yourself and learn skills (including management skills at your McDonald's job) that make you a better part of society then you don't get to whine and ask for handouts from society. If you pay people the same to put fries in a paper bag as people that work overnight stocking shelves or working in the sun, installing a roof on a house, those people will either want more money or quit their jobs to do easier work for the same money
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, yep. And it doesn't matter. Still doesn't change the fact that they were working for a multi-billion dollar industry and most likely generating far more money for the company than they ever get to see. Just because a burger flipper job is seen as "beneath" others, that gives places the right to set low wages just because? Then those same people who work 40 hours a week still have to rely on government benefits at the end of the day. That's your tax dollars all because the CEO simply choose not to pay their employees more. Elsewhere, a child actor can work for 3 months and get paid more than the both of us combined make in a year and I can assure you it's not because they just worked that much harder. But the revenue they generated for their employer justifies it.
If min wage goes up won't the cost of all the products go up accordingly. Thus negating the increase.
@Sr5turbo, nah. you’re raising the price floor, the inflation you’re thinking of happens when all of society gets a multiplicative payraise, like “everyone gets 1.2x their current salary” but a min wage increase or a BAH that raises the floor by a constant rather than linearly doesnt appreciably affect inflation
@Hoban Washburne, wrong, see Seattle as fun fact
@Hoban Washburne, except if they get a pay raise at the bottom, bringing their wages closer to mine then I have been revoked the incentive to do a skilled job when I can go back to working at mcds giving zero fūcks about anything and make almost the same.
thus employers for my trade would have to pay more to re-incetivise people and it just goes up the ladder from their until basically we all move up a rung achieving nothing.
granted I am underpaid for what I currently do and that's why I'm looking for a new job. but increases like that do squeeze on smaller companys who work for cheaper, so it really only hurts the consumer.
@JoeJoestar, you’re looking at it as a single-variate problem. if i walked up to the average high schooler and said “4 years of college, be a teacher, quit rn, be a landscaper, they make the same” folks are still gonna go teacher, go office worker, go any given college-educated 50k/yr job. $8 or $15, people dont want to be the mcdonalds people. your scenario is an oversimplification because the incentive to achieve is certainly monetary, but is nowhere close to singularly monetary
@JoeJoestar, as for the small company squeeze, tax breaks for small companies are a great incentivization and survivability option that would free the capital necessary for living wages in unskilled labor areas. somewhat tangential, but tax exemptions for small business are always a great idea and would likely be released accompanying a bill implementing a higher min wage as has been the case in the past
@Hoban your first quote was so all over the place but I assume you're saying that if you told a high schooler that they could make the same as a teacher by being a landscaper and it would save them tons of money in debt and time in school, that they'd still choose to be a teacher???? lol hardly. if they did it would solely be benefits/lack of physical labor. also you completely disregarded my point by skipping every middle tier paying job and using a fairly low tier in comparison to a high one.
also the down vote was a nice touch, really drove home how pointless conversing with you on this matter would be.
@JoeJoestar, ya know, the downvote wasnt very fair of me, that was a dissenting opinion, not anything hostile. can be hard to tell over text, i misinterpreted.
but c’mon, your arguments way off, think about municipal employees like trashmen. solid wage, government benefits and pension, awesome job in terms of perks and money compared to effort. people want jobs that make them think people respect them, they choose jobs for 10m reasons other than wage. and yeah wage is one of the bigger factors, but a min wage increase doesnt cause a linear increase in average wage like you seem to think
@JoeJoestar, taking your argument that it would propagate through the market and cause a wage increase, the increase would be a magnitude increase to the scale of the raise. i.e. “hey that cashier makes 15, i should make more”
“ok you get 5 more, so you still make 5 more/hr than the cashier”
that only rises so high until people stop caring about a $5 difference, an engineer doesnt care about a $5 gap when they make 6 figures. the effect on all but the lowest paid people is negligible. the wage for poor employees would definitely improve, the only real downside is the possible automation and unemployment, which is a valid but wholly different argument
Hey if you want it on the side that’s your problem
Maybe they'll try if they know they're making a living wage lol
@Ricochet5095, minimum wage is just that. Just enough to survive. It’s not for having a new car or a good phone and internet plan.
Meanwhile that EMT that’s working to save your momma after she had a stroke is only making 13 an hour.
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, funnily enough I don't remember writing that he should have a six figure salary. I'm saying that ten million and fifteen thousand is a large gap and you know what it wouldn't kill someone to take a more modest paycheck so their fellow humans can have a more decent living. Costco has been paying their employees a fair amount since 1997 and amazingly the economy isn't crashing down around us, the CEO is still rich, and Costco is still running. I don't exactly believe in the $15 an hour wage thing, like you I believe that will be taken advantage of, I do believe that raises should be more readily available. My comment was of disgust towards people having a fit that people less fortunate than them actually wanting to make a decent living because they make so much, people lower than them have to make so much less, instead of there being a more equal distribution of money.
How about just dental if you stick around a year or so
In Texas, $15 is more than most bottom level employees make (Starbucks pays $9-$10 per hour). The standard of living is $30000 less than on the coasts. National minimum wage doesn't make sense!
Pay them more if you want cheese on it bltches
The person possibly ordered it as *Cheese on the side*
@Pervy Sage Jiraiya, who the actual fvck orders cheese "on the side?" I could totally understand if it was like melted cheese but that has like never been offered at McDonald's
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, *shrugs* it's highly unlikely, but there's a slim chance
@Drunk Pantless Uncle, You underestimate the weirdness of customers.
You had one job...